Cables - one of the most taboo subjects in audio

[Mather]

New question for anyone with experience, or just willing to think through options.
The real question is higher end AQ power cables in core placement, or more cables being replaces with more midrange options?

Using the same budget, which might you try:
- Synergistic Foundation + upgrade some Zu Mission cables to Zu Event + Sutherland LPS for 20/20 (3 new cables. Syn into power supply. Event into amp and dac)
- AudioQuest Hurricane - one high current, one source

I can likely demo the AudioQuest in my system, and possibly the Synergistic, but Zu would be a leap of blind faith.

If it's me I'm definitely going the first route, blanket everything and get the LPS. The AC cables in my system definitely made a difference but it was maybe like a 5% difference and some added stage, I don't think it would be necessary to blow everything on two very expensive Audioquest cables rather than very nice ZU ACs for everything and the LPS.

 

[SnowmaNick]

I have a full loom of AQ cables in my 2 channel set up, and all PC and IC in my theater. I’m a fan.

So, I’m predictably voting for AQ. But I wouldn’t go for the Hurricane. I’d either go for a Thunder and, depending on price difference, either a Blizzard or Z3. Or, a few Blizzards.

I also don’t see the point to the LPS for the 20/20, even Ron Sutherland doesn’t. Use that money elsewhere.

Just my $.02.

 

[displayname]

If it's me I'm definitely going the first route, blanket everything and get the LPS. The AC cables in my system definitely made a difference but it was maybe like a 5% difference and some added stage, I don't think it would be necessary to blow everything on two very expensive Audioquest cables rather than very nice ZU ACs for everything and the LPS.

I’ve been in A/B testing situations where I felt some (not all) power cables made a bigger difference than I was expecting. After hearing a Zu Mission cable vs several others on a dac, I was surprised how much I was able to identify some weaknesses with the Zu in the test system that are also apparent in my system.

So conversely I’m almost thinking buy once, cry once. Even if it can only go directly on a few components right away. Plus that may prevent me wanting to upgrade again down the line. I haven’t regretted that choice with other components.

I have a full loom of AQ cables in my 2 channel set up, and all PC and IC in my theater. I’m a fan.

So, I’m predictably voting for AQ. But I wouldn’t go for the Hurricane. I’d either go for a Thunder and, depending on price difference, either a Blizzard or Z3. Or, a few Blizzards.

I also don’t see the point to the LPS for the 20/20, even Ron Sutherland doesn’t. Use that money elsewhere.

Just my $.02.

Did you compare the Blizzard to the Hurricane? Just curious if you heard both and were surprised how close they were vs just trying to be more economical?

On the Sutherland, that’s absolutely something I’ve thought about. A member here recently made the jump to the LPS and he said he wouldn’t suggest it at full price.

 

[SnowmaNick]

Did you compare the Blizzard to the Hurricane? Just curious if you heard both and were surprised how close they were vs just trying to be more economical?

On the Sutherland, that’s absolutely something I’ve thought about. A member here recently made the jump to the LPS and he said he wouldn’t suggest it at full price.

I’ve A/B tested the Hurricane and Thunder. They are different, but it was, in my system, so small a difference as to not be worth it for me. I use Thunder on my integrated and my tube phono pre. I use Blizzard on the digital side for the DAC, Monsoon on the streamer, and a Z3 on the DDC. I tried different configurations and went with the cables I felt, “maxed” out the difference for each component.

I’m sure if I used all Thunder or higher I may notice a bit of improvement, but for me this was the sweet spot.

 

[Angsty]

I have a strong bias against AQ cables and high-end cables in general. I use Blue Jeans cables for all my interconnects for their principled engineering, construction quality and reasonable pricing.

I have never heard an equipment manufacturer saying that an upgraded power cable improves the sound of their product nor do I see them offering upgraded power cables with their branding. ‘Nuff said.

 

[SnowmaNick]

I have a strong bias against AQ cables and high-end cables in general. I use Blue Jeans cables for all my interconnects for their principled engineering, construction quality and reasonable pricing.

I have never heard an equipment manufacturer saying that an upgraded power cable improves the sound of their product nor do I see them offering upgraded power cables with their branding. ‘Nuff said.

To each their own of course. I had plenty of BJC stuff, it’s not bad and is well made.

As for manufacturers, Denafrips doesn’t even include power cables with their gear. Naim and Decware (Steve is a big proponent of upgraded cables, especially pc’s), both offer power cable “upgrade paths.” There are probably others.

I only bring this up as there are manufacturers who disagree with your assertion.

 

[Angsty]

To each their own of course. I had plenty of BJC stuff, it’s not bad and is well made.

As for manufacturers, Denafrips doesn’t even include power cables with their gear. Naim and Decware (Steve is a big proponent of upgraded cables, especially pc’s), both offer power cable “upgrade paths.” There are probably others.

I only bring this up as there are manufacturers who disagree with your assertion.

Thank you for those examples - I was unaware of them.

 

[Joe Mac]

To each their own of course. I had plenty of BJC stuff, it’s not bad and is well made.

As for manufacturers, Denafrips doesn’t even include power cables with their gear. Naim and Decware (Steve is a big proponent of upgraded cables, especially pc’s), both offer power cable “upgrade paths.” There are probably others.

I only bring this up as there are manufacturers who disagree with your assertion.

PS Audio too, it’s in all their manuals.

 

[Angsty]

PS Audio too, it’s in all their manuals.

Indeed, PS Audio does.

This is my perspective as a snake oil skeptic: I don’t see a physics-based reason why a premium power cord should make an audible difference versus an included cord. I can definitely see how it may impact psychologically or aesthetically l, but not how it makes a measurable performance difference.

I hold no grudge over people who make that choice, but it is not my choice.

 

[displayname]

I have a strong bias against AQ cables and high-end cables in general. I use Blue Jeans cables for all my interconnects for their principled engineering, construction quality and reasonable pricing.

I have never heard an equipment manufacturer saying that an upgraded power cable improves the sound of their product nor do I see them offering upgraded power cables with their branding. ‘Nuff said.

I don’t try to convert anyone to believe in cables unless they are in the room and we have cables that I feel are notably different. Some people hear a difference, some don’t. And some hear a difference and simply feel they are both good but different, no element of “better.”

If you haven’t heard the difference, and you’re not convinced it’s worth experimenting with, save your cash.

All I can say is that I’ve heard enough cable differences in a/b and blind tests that I’m willing to spend some cash to try some changes.

 

[Angsty]

Although I have strong science bias for myself, I also believe “go with what you like that makes you happy.” That’s what all of this is about in the end - enjoying what you have and what you are hearing.

I own a big, heavy, black Bryston amp that really does not perform differently for me than my lighter, less heat-emitting NAD amp. But, I like the look and feel of the Bryston, which is why it stays in my stack. It makes me happier.

For cables, I hate the idea of being bamboozled which is why I stick with straight-up engineering and science. Having a fancy cable that has no real science behind it would not make me happier. Everybody has their happy place - experiment with what takes you to your happy place.

 

[displayname]

Got to do some testing yesterday with some interesting outcomes. We tried the AQ Hurricanes along with some other high cables, things that are silly expensive. When I say silly, I mean at one point we had 3 power cables involved that surpassed the retail value of my total system, and that’s before inner connections and speaker cables are in the mix.

That’s obviously well beyond anything I can or would spend in my foreseeable lifetime, but I had the option so we tried it. Best part was getting to demo in my own system, in my own home.

Here’s the part that I found the most interesting: I currently run a Wireworld spaceport for power filtering, and when we had my standard Zu Mission going to the wall>SP with very high end stuff going from the SP to the amp and dac, we really hit a sweet spot. But once we added an AQ Dragon between the wall and SP, it was like something went too far. It just didn’t mesh quite the same. Similar outcome when we went from the amp straight to the wall with something silly expensive. For my specific system, the magic seemed to happen when we went Zu Mission >SP>higher end power cables > components. Wasn’t the outcome I was expecting, but it does save me long run money and was an interesting test.

The next dragon I’ll likely be chasing is interconnects. That proved to be next big bottle neck in my system.

Overall a fun afternoon, and a great reminder that you really just need to try stuff sometimes to get a sense of if it’s a fit for you or not.

 

[Mather]

Got to do some testing yesterday with some interesting outcomes. We tried the AQ Hurricanes along with some other high cables, things that are silly expensive. When I say silly, I mean at one point we had 3 power cables involved that surpassed the retail value of my total system, and that’s before inner connections and speaker cables are in the mix.

That’s obviously well beyond anything I can or would spend in my foreseeable lifetime, but I had the option so we tried it. Best part was getting to demo in my own system, in my own home.

Here’s the part that I found the most interesting: I currently run a Wireworld spaceport for power filtering, and when we had my standard Zu Mission going to the wall>SP with very high end stuff going from the SP to the amp and dac, we really hit a sweet spot. But once we added an AQ Dragon between the wall and SP, it was like something went too far. It just didn’t mesh quite the same. Similar outcome when we went from the amp straight to the wall with something silly expensive. For my specific system, the magic seemed to happen when we went Zu Mission >SP>higher end power cables > components. Wasn’t the outcome I was expecting, but it does save me long run money and was an interesting test.

The next dragon I’ll likely be chasing is interconnects. That proved to be next big bottle neck in my system.

Overall a fun afternoon, and a great reminder that you really just need to try stuff sometimes to get a sense of if it’s a fit for you or not.

I remember when I was auditioning my cables I had this very expensive set of speaker cables that were one of those large braided types that look awesome but also kinda like overkill but I sort of assumed they would smoke my other ones. I can't remember the brand but they were very silver forward, maybe double coated or something of the sort. They were so harsh and shrill in my system that I lasted about 3 minutes before I had to swap them out. Just did not play right at all, but the difference to the ones I bought was staggering, it sounded like a different system between one and the other. Prior to that I didn't believe cables made much, if any difference... that definitely was the moment where my opinion changed.

 

[displayname]

Yeah, it took me longer to get behind power cables. I don’t think they quite make the difference that others in the system do, but as I’ve demoed more I have been surprised about how different they can be.

 

[Angsty]

Roger Russell knew speaker cables.

Speaker Wire

www.roger-russell.com

 

[Jbraswell]

Got to do some testing yesterday with some interesting outcomes. We tried the AQ Hurricanes along with some other high cables, things that are silly expensive. When I say silly, I mean at one point we had 3 power cables involved that surpassed the retail value of my total system, and that’s before inner connections and speaker cables are in the mix.

That’s obviously well beyond anything I can or would spend in my foreseeable lifetime, but I had the option so we tried it. Best part was getting to demo in my own system, in my own home.

Here’s the part that I found the most interesting: I currently run a Wireworld spaceport for power filtering, and when we had my standard Zu Mission going to the wall>SP with very high end stuff going from the SP to the amp and dac, we really hit a sweet spot. But once we added an AQ Dragon between the wall and SP, it was like something went too far. It just didn’t mesh quite the same. Similar outcome when we went from the amp straight to the wall with something silly expensive. For my specific system, the magic seemed to happen when we went Zu Mission >SP>higher end power cables > components. Wasn’t the outcome I was expecting, but it does save me long run money and was an interesting test.

The next dragon I’ll likely be chasing is interconnects. That proved to be next big bottle neck in my system.

Overall a fun afternoon, and a great reminder that you really just need to try stuff sometimes to get a sense of if it’s a fit for you or not.

I didn't have a good experience with power cable upgrade and sent it back. Also the amperage did not mesh and the Panamax power conditioner certainly did not like the extra draw.

My best cable upgrade was (phono) from TT to amp. Shorter 1M length and a nice improvement over the Technics generic RCAs.
Tributaries Series 8 sounded better. How much better is impossible to quantify but I decided they were worth the coin.

KG is a big proponent of cables. Obviously, he is hearing something different and many people are liking the mastering sound after he changed out his cables.

 

[Angsty]

My best cable upgrade was (phono) from TT to amp. Shorter 1M length and a nice improvement over the Technics generic RCAs.

That was true for me, too. I moved from an old Straightwire Symphony II cable to a new BJC LC-1 and got better high frequency response.

The LC-1 was designed to be very low capacitance whereas the Straightwire was rather high. This mattered with my previous MM cartridge but matters much less with my MC cart.

I subsequently changed out all the Symphony II cables for BJC due to the Straightwires becoming sticky due to aging and plasticizer deterioration.

 

[Angsty]

I didn't have a good experience with power cable upgrade and sent it back. Also the amperage did not mesh and the Panamax power conditioner certainly did not like the extra draw.

If anyone in the US is considering a power cable upgrade, do make sure the new cable is UL Listed for your safety. A surprising number of audiophile cables are not.

 

[Ghost]

Alright friends. Some brainstorming for the group here:

I'm currently trying to chase a buzz/hiss out of my system that becomes audible near the top of my typical listening range. Its not something that I can focus on during the music but I can hear it between songs lightly and I imagine it colors some of the sound I hear.

Currently my set-up is limited in the sense that my TT, my amp, and phono all need to live on the same surface, the Sutherland seems to be picking up a good deal of interference and ambient noise from the new amp and I've pushed it as far away as possible but am limited in what I can do.

I'm asking here for ideas because I've noticed the buzz noise increases when I play around with the cables behind my rig, I've been able to lessen some of the buzz by taping the blue jeans to the back of my cabinet on one side, but I'm wondering if upgrading the cables running from my phono into my amp would be a good thing to do? Or upgrading the phones power cable? Not sure, dont have a lot of experience with power supplies or cables.

Also, wondering how much of the buzz might be a result of all my gear sharing a power strip? If so, how could I start upgrading in a way that negate that? Here's a pic, brace yourselves lol

Currently I have one pair of BJCs running from my TT to my phono and everything else is a hodge podge of cheapies from Amazon :$.

 

[MikeH]

Alright friends. Some brainstorming for the group here:

I'm currently trying to chase a buzz/hiss out of my system that becomes audible near the top of my typical listening range. Its not something that I can focus on during the music but I can hear it between songs lightly and I imagine it colors some of the sound I hear.

Currently my set-up is limited in the sense that my TT, my amp, and phono all need to live on the same surface, the Sutherland seems to be picking up a good deal of interference and ambient noise from the new amp and I've pushed it as far away as possible but am limited in what I can do.

I'm asking here for ideas because I've noticed the buzz noise increases when I play around with the cables behind my rig, I've been able to lessen some of the buzz by taping the blue jeans to the back of my cabinet on one side, but I'm wondering if upgrading the cables running from my phono into my amp would be a good thing to do? Or upgrading the phones power cable? Not sure, dont have a lot of experience with power supplies or cables.

Also, wondering how much of the buzz might be a result of all my gear sharing a power strip? If so, how could I start upgrading in a way that negate that? Here's a pic, brace yourselves lol

Currently I have one pair of BJCs running from my TT to my phono and everything else is a hodge podge of cheapies from Amazon :$.

View attachment 193518

try changing the positioning of the amp and phono? someone here (maybe @AnthonyI ) said that they swapped positioning of separates and it got rid of a hum. had to do with where the power transformers were on the devices or something?

i have a hum that i've given up on trying to get rid of. i'm convinced that it's in my house wiring.