Hip Hop
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Kr00ked
Well-Known Member
Lol that's his point. In his mind we as a people should not be ok with still being motivated or outraged by these kinds of tactics and I actually agree with him. He knew this would be the reaction not because "he wanted this reaction", but the exact opposite. He's tired of us being controlled by this type of shit.
Either most people are just now really catching on to how racist this country is and always has been or I'm just too desensetized to the shit because I actually have to deal with it, but it's 2022. A rapper putting White Lives Matter on a t-shirt, even if he 100% means it, doesn't trigger anything in me but a "well that's odd" and my life goes on. This shit is only as powerful as WE choose to make it and I'd be got damned if we didn't prove him right. Lol
But I guess it's easier for most "groups", from your average Joe to your favorite rapper, to just sit behind a keyboard and call Kanye a crazy white supremacist and feel like they've actually put their foot down against "racism" somehow.
And yes, I've seen plenty of comments wishing violence upon ye for this shit
Kr00ked
Well-Known Member
Are we back at the point again where we all sit quietly and wait for Dead C to come say some shit that y'all can't so you can hit "like" on it and continue focusing on the "crazy" rapper that put words on a shirt that we're all supposed to show how extremely outraged we are about? 
dirty hands
Well-Known Member
Everyone has their opinions on Kanye I'm not here to tell anyone how to think. I was triggered by the Kanye 2024 comment, and maybe that was the intention. I took the bait. I don’t know what the answer is for this country. Definitely not another rich celebrity.
BazookaTooth
Well-Known Member
was the shipping cheaper than usually for you too ?
gaporter
Well-Known Member
Opinions on Kanye's shirt aside, I feel like you should really reflect on why you feel the need to defend the actions of a world-famous musician and billionaire by putting words in his mouth. If Kanye actually came out and stated that any of what you just posted was his reasoning, that's one thing, and I retract my statement. But time and time again, whenever Kanye pulls a stunt like this to get a reaction out of people, his fans come out of the woodwork to justify his actions and look down on others for not understanding his brilliant commentary.
If he's really the great free thinker his devotees think he is, why am I only ever seeing these elaborate explanations from his fans and not from him directly? Is it simply that we're all too dumb to be playing on Kanye's level of 4D chess, or is the more likely explanation that Kanye is just a provocateur who knows he can do whatever he wants because a) he's rich and b) his hardcore supporters ride so hard for him there's nothing they won't find a way to absolve him of. It's parasocial fandom at its finest, people feeling obligated to defend an artist as a person rather than just enjoying the work they put out and understanding that bending over backwards to make excuses for someone they'll likely never even have a conversation with will only lead to disappointment.
For what it's worth, though it's been a while since I've thoroughly enjoyed a Kanye project, I support his free speech and his right to say and wear whatever the hell he wants. If he wants to knowingly adorn himself with a white supremacist slogan, then he can knock himself out, but that doesn’t mean everyone else has to just blindly accept it and assume, "oh, well I'm sure there's a perfectly good reason he's doing all this." He deserves to face the consequences for what kind of messaging, genuine or not, he puts out into the world, and it shouldn't be anyone else's responsibility to speak up for him when he gets himself in a tight spot.
Tillman
Well-Known Member
yeah, there's a lot of things in Kanye's mind. he can want people to not get outraged by him wearing a shirt aimed to outrage, but when they do that doesn't mean he's correct. if that's what he's actually doing then it's dumb. so Kanye thinks people shouldn't be offended by that statement...ok, now what? he gets to act righteous for predicting a foregone conclusion? I don't know, to me that's not the 4D chess you're posing here.
if you don't think it's an outrageous statement to make/shirt to wear then we certainly have a difference in opinion there, but whatever I'm not going to lose sleep over that. like I said earlier I stopped following the story at the headline. it's not interesting or shocking to me at all, even if I don't agree with it. I think most people, especially here on this forum, in a hip-hop thread aren't too shocked by shock tactics... so not sure why you're assuming everyone here has been owned by Kanye. but that's all it is, shock tactics... the various statements, putting abusers on a platform, etc., he's a fucking shock-jock now to help stay relevant. it's that's what he wants to be that's fine, but let's not act like he's exposing the ills America for some greater good... to me it looks like he enjoys being a dick.
as far as violence against Kanye, I'll never condone it, but I'm sure he was getting e-threats for simply making a "gospel" album, so I'm not surprised people would say some vile, wild shit... but again, who thought anything different would happened besides Kanye? it doesn't prove any point. and not that this is an excuse to make a threat towards Kanye, but it's not like Kanye is above making threats, so again what did he prove?
Kr00ked
Well-Known Member
Yes, because clearly I'm the one here who needs to reflect on what I'm saying lol. I'm not defending anyone and at this point the idea that he needs random fans help getting him out of "tight spots" is bizarre to me
.I also don't know what his money status and such has to do with my comments.
I haven't put words in anyone's mouth unlike the many comments I've seen from those who literally admit to "not following everything He says" and "only go off the headlines" yet still somehow find a way to have an opposing outraged opinion on his life and actions. It doesn't take the cliche "4d chess" talk to know that he has made his intentions pretty clear for years now to those who have actually listened. So feel free to direct this logic somewhere else. I don't know maybe I'm the crazy one but the guy in here cussing out and calling this "musician and billionaire" a waste of space and oxygen" seems like a better start for you.
I'll consider this comment "retracted" as it stands.
Tillman
Well-Known Member
you're literally defending Kanye as you say "I'm not defending anyone"...Yes, because clearly I'm the one here who needs to reflect on what I'm saying lol. I'm not defending anyone and at this point the idea that he needs random fans help getting him out of "tight spots" is bizarre to me
I also don't know what his money status and such has to do with my comments.
I haven't put words in anyone's mouth unlike the many comments I've seen from those who literally admit to "not following everything He says" and "only go off the headlines" yet still somehow find a way to have an opposing outraged opinion on his life and actions. It doesn't take the cliche "4d chess" talk to know that he has made his intentions pretty clear for years now to those who have actually listened. So feel free to direct this logic somewhere else. I don't know maybe I'm the crazy one but the guy in here cussing out and calling this "musician and billionaire" a waste of space and oxygen" seems like a better start for you.
I'll consider this comment "retracted" as it stands.
yes, at this point I can surmise that from a headline that Kanye is being a troll here based off his history. I don't think I've expressed any outrage here other than thinking that wearing a "White Lives Matter" shirt is a dick move, so yeah...
Tillman
Well-Known Member
also, you may not want to act high and mighty after making comments like this, or is this more of that sweet, sweet Kanye 4D chess you're playing?
Kr00ked
Well-Known Member
You tell me lol. It was you that said "if people are so outraged that they want to cut his head off and piss down his neck, then yeah he certainly exposed something." And now that I've confirmed such threats, like clockwork, that goal post gets shifted just a little further.
"there's a lot of things in Kanye's mind. he can want people to not get outraged by him wearing a shirt aimed to outrage, but when they do that doesn't mean he's correct. if that's what he's actually doing then it's dumb.
I'm sorry you feel that way, I guess. Opinions, aye?
"so Kanye thinks people shouldn't be offended by that statement...ok, now what?"
This i where folks decide if they agree or disagree with him and go from there.
Look I'm not here to hold hands or go back and forth for 5 pages against already made up minds and opinions, especially from folks who admit they haven't really followed everything.
I said my piece, y'all can take it and do whatever it is you want with it in order to keep feeling however it is you want or need to feel about all of this.
Ima go play soccer with my 3 year old and try not to think think about all the different replies I'll be getting from y'all over this shit.
#ye2024 and I'm out
Kr00ked
Well-Known Member
you're literally defending Kanye as you say "I'm not defending anyone"...
yes, at this point I can surmise that from a headline that Kanye is being a troll here based off his history. I don't think I've expressed any outrage here other than thinking that wearing a "White Lives Matter" shirt is a dick move, so yeah...
Cool bro. Whatever you need to tell yourself. Peace
Tillman
Well-Known Member
yeah, that's my point. you're the only one who thinks people want to cut off Kanye's head and piss down his neck.You tell me lol. It was you that said "if people are so outraged that they want to cut his head off and piss down his neck, then yeah he certainly exposed something." And now that I've confirmed such threats, like clockwork, that goal post gets shifted just a little further.
"there's a lot of things in Kanye's mind. he can want people to not get outraged by him wearing a shirt aimed to outrage, but when they do that doesn't mean he's correct. if that's what he's actually doing then it's dumb.
I'm sorry you feel that way, I guess. Opinions, aye?
"so Kanye thinks people shouldn't be offended by that statement...ok, now what?"
This i where folks decide if they agree or disagree with him and go from there.
Look I'm not here to hold hands or go back and forth for 5 pages against already made up minds and opinions, especially from folks who admit they haven't really followed everything.
I said my piece, y'all can take it and do whatever it is you want with it in order to keep feeling however it is you want or need to feel about all of this.
Ima go play soccer with my 3 year old and try not to think think about all the different replies I'll be getting from y'all over this shit.
#ye2024 and I'm out
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and don't feel sorry for me, I didn't ask for you to feel sorry for me. for someone who is taking the position of the high road you are pretty good at taking shots at people who are simply engaging in conversation
Dead C
Well-Known Member
Kanye fans gonna Kanye. You mentioned me, so here's the tl;dr "unprovoked" response that you illicit.
My reaction isn't to Kanye and never is, it's to the stupid as fuck reactions to him. I ignore that dude, because everything about him is boring and, if it wasn't, then he wouldn't need to try and provoke reactions and go out of his way for publicity stunts. So much more interesting stuff going on in hip-hop. Mach Hommy is a million times more interesting than Kanye. You really believe dude is being cheeky with this shirt bullshit, just like you think that posting smiley images in your posts represent that you aren't phased; just a chill guy that can't believe everyone is so up in arms. I see it as a generational thing of the internet age. "Calm down dude, I'm only trying to stoke a fire so that I can sit back and dodge accountability, acting like I don't know where it came from." Poke some shit and then act surprised by the repercussions. Not surprising that the reaction to the stunt is the same as the stunt itself. The problem is that almost everything presented here contradicts itself, so it crumbles immediately.
You're out here claiming that Kanye thinks people shouldn't give attention or weight to what public figures do or say? What foundation are you basing that on? The fact that he's constantly demanding focus and an audience? The fact that he's claimed that, whenever he doesn't get it, it's because he's being oppressed or blacklisted? If your response is that he's preached that message in interviews, if he has, then that only reinforces that this is the exact point of this dude. He's a contradiction and doesn't really stand for shit. The only people feeding a deeper meaning into him are you guys. If his actions are empty actions being filled with our own perception, think about that. This is a chicken or the egg situation and you seem to have a different opinion of which came first. Are those claiming he's promoting white supremacy just because he's wearing a white supremacist slogan next to Candace owens for a photo op the ones reading into it and projecting into his actions, or are the ones that have this elaborate theory about how it's a brilliant social experiment? Either way, to suggest that he doesn't believe the public should react by trying to elicit reactions doesn't hold water, at least not from this dude. As someone who decided to drop my name, while intentionally not tagging me, you should understand the difference between making an actual statement and desiring a reaction from one.
I was never the one that posted about Kanye or his shirt. My problem is that people like yourself believe he's some genius and are elevating him over some lazy cornball shit. I'm responding to your reactions and what you are projecting into it, not the other way around. You think he put on a shirt and a bunch of people lost their minds about hypotheticals, but you don't seem to have a real grasp on the situation. What happened was, this dude put on a shirt and people rushed out en masse to congratulate him on wearing it, specifically BECAUSE they see it as promoting white supremacy. The hypotheticals have already occurred and there's a reaction to THAT. Was my comment the first one about Kanye in here, or was I responding to someone for praising him about how people are "too woke" and that race doesn't matter and we should be focusing on shit like class solidarity? The point here is that Kanye IS FOCUSING ON CLASS SOLIDARITY and any one of you that think he's speaking to you in that regard need to go watch some George Carlin, because that class he's so solid with... you ain't in it. I'll admit that there was a time when Kanye shook shit up and spoke the truth. When he said, "George Bush doesn't care about black people" that shit was real. Y'all want to believe he's a man of the people now, even though he's done nothing but focus on himself and view personal elevation as being a symbol of something greater. "Anyone who has ever had to struggle, be doubted, or face racial oppression can prove the world wrong!!!" What he's really saying is, "Fuck y'all! Nobody can tell me how I can and can't get mine!" Conway is out there serving turkeys and shoes to his community. Kanye is out here making idiots fight each other over melted UGGs, because the hype beasts buy their style in a can with a SUPREME sticker pasted on the side. His antics aren't career suicide, because he's targeting other demographics at the expense of a different fanbase that runs cover for him.
I don't give a fuck about celebrities. I don't respect Jay Z for admitting in a song that he's made millions selling trash verses rather than caring about the art. Jay coming out claiming that "capitalism" is a swear word now, telling people not to use it, and criticizing Kaepernick, while teaming with the NFL is more fucked up than this t-shirt situation, but it's really easy to see it for what it is, a rich guy making moves of self-interest, directly at the sacrifice of the people he claims to represent. But who is gonna buy more Jay Z records if he finds himself offending one particular side? White people that like what he's selling. How can Kanye pull this garbage and know it won't affect his bottom line? Because he has a largely white fanbase and the very institutions that he claims are holding him back and limiting him are the ones that he's pandering to and will keep him afloat. This isn't a bold attack at a system, it's WWE shit. The truth is that people have a huge list of excuses for Jay, too. They may not get as elaborate and twisted as the Kanye apologists, but it's the same shit.
Dead C
Well-Known Member
I understand that not everyone understands the symbolism behind everything, because Kanye himself has admitted that he doesn't understand the symbolism of half of his actions and hasn't bothered to educate himself. That doesn't mean that those who DO understand the symbolism and do have a grasp on it are somehow emotionally ignorant, for being educated. I can go to another country and threaten to murder their children, but if they arrest me, it's not enough to just explain that I don't actually speak the language or know what I was saying, but felt like yelling it through a megaphone at the airport anyway.
For example, the confederate flag and purpose of the confederacy is clearly established and outlined in detail in the cornerstone speech, which states plainly that the atrocities suffered by black slaves would, admittedly, be unconscionable and horrific IF THEY WERE HUMAN, but since black people aren't fully human, it's justified and they are willing to launch into all-out war with the US government to retain the right to maintain that power and federal right to continue committing those atrocities. Kanye wears the flag... I ignore it. If someone comes into the hip-hop thread praising that shit and explaining why the flag has no meaning and wasn't about slavery, etc. etc. That's different. If Kanye does a photoshoot with the flag next to Robert E Lee and a grand wizard of the KKK who specifically promoted that flag infused with that meaning... that's a different issue. Kanye wore a White Lives Matter shirt alongside Candace Owens, an "influencer" who denies the existence of the systemic racism that you and I experience every day. She's defended white nationalism, because it would have been "ok" if Hitler just wanted to keep Germany great and not spread beyond his own country. She's anti-NAACP and vocally on the side of murderous cops, by blaming the victims. Posing with her means something different. But the hypocrisy of the Kanye apologist is often that "he didn't know." He's a bold yet innocent ignorant genius. He has conviction and purpose, yet is floating around aimlessly and without fault. Move the pieces where they fit, but they don't fit.
So, ultimately, the guy is an idiot with too much power. If that's the message, then point taken, but he's still an idiot and his actions still have power. Cool point. He's a basic clown and that's fine. He can be ignored. He's screaming that he's a genius doing genius shit though, and a lot of you are doing the same thing.
For example, the confederate flag and purpose of the confederacy is clearly established and outlined in detail in the cornerstone speech, which states plainly that the atrocities suffered by black slaves would, admittedly, be unconscionable and horrific IF THEY WERE HUMAN, but since black people aren't fully human, it's justified and they are willing to launch into all-out war with the US government to retain the right to maintain that power and federal right to continue committing those atrocities. Kanye wears the flag... I ignore it. If someone comes into the hip-hop thread praising that shit and explaining why the flag has no meaning and wasn't about slavery, etc. etc. That's different. If Kanye does a photoshoot with the flag next to Robert E Lee and a grand wizard of the KKK who specifically promoted that flag infused with that meaning... that's a different issue. Kanye wore a White Lives Matter shirt alongside Candace Owens, an "influencer" who denies the existence of the systemic racism that you and I experience every day. She's defended white nationalism, because it would have been "ok" if Hitler just wanted to keep Germany great and not spread beyond his own country. She's anti-NAACP and vocally on the side of murderous cops, by blaming the victims. Posing with her means something different. But the hypocrisy of the Kanye apologist is often that "he didn't know." He's a bold yet innocent ignorant genius. He has conviction and purpose, yet is floating around aimlessly and without fault. Move the pieces where they fit, but they don't fit.
So, ultimately, the guy is an idiot with too much power. If that's the message, then point taken, but he's still an idiot and his actions still have power. Cool point. He's a basic clown and that's fine. He can be ignored. He's screaming that he's a genius doing genius shit though, and a lot of you are doing the same thing.
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Jonathan Y
Well-Known Member
Kanye was made famous by the people to entertain. Then there was a shift right before Obama left office which led to people looking at celebrity to be the change/leaders of the world. Unfortunately it's only gotten worse and now it's gotten to a point of no return because anyone can ultimately become a celeb and have a platform. That fact alone has lead to a rat race among celebrities to be the most influential and in this instance and countless others the result is someone going too far for 'clout'...Kanye leads that race. I hate the word clout btw.
I wanna go back to the posse cut remix days where everyone just did it for money and dance tracks would somehow steal the show by the end of the year. Way less stressful that way
That's all I got on it.
I wanna go back to the posse cut remix days where everyone just did it for money and dance tracks would somehow steal the show by the end of the year. Way less stressful that way
That's all I got on it.
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Believer101
Well-Known Member
2e7en
Well-Known Member
Damn i missed a whole kanye discussion? After this week, I can safely say he has become the biggest clown in the history of hip-hop without a doubt. A pure joke in every way possible. I wish I could go back to high school and tell myself this is what came of him to see my reaction, id probably punch myself.
Anyways, i also completely missed the super tecmo bo drop so a black vinyl will do for this one i guess
Did receive my Saba joint yesterday tho!
Anyways, i also completely missed the super tecmo bo drop so a black vinyl will do for this one i guess
Did receive my Saba joint yesterday tho!
Jonathan Y
Well-Known Member
Rumors r its Duck Czn Part 2 and drops on the 28th