Neverending Covid-19 Coronavirus

ranbalam said:
I can stay off Twitter and Facebook to avoid the anti-maskers and virus hoaxers, but unfortunately I have to work with a couple. Just now, five minutes before I began typing this, he's walking around telling everyone here at work not to get tested because they are giving you Covid with these tests. It's just so irresponsible to spread this kind of info.

He also showed me that his phone now has a Covid Infection Tracker app that he didn't install and can't uninstall and said we all have that tracker. (I checked, I don't)
I let him know that he can simply ditch his phone if he wants to get off the grid and he laughed, like that's an impossibility.
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But I thought we weren't getting tracked until they implant the micro chip in the vaccine??? I can't keep it all straight anymore.
 
dbarila said:
Working if you accept a much higher than average death toll.
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We could never do what Sweden did as an entire country, but perhaps a more measured approach is needed on a state by state or even county by county basis. Our country is more akin to the entire European Union in terms of heterogeneity and population, but our healthcare system is a mess and our population is extremely individualistic.

However, Sweden got hammered for their approach and their deaths per million are better than Belgium, UK, Spain, and Italy. We also don't have the full picture yet. Spain has relatively unaffected areas spiking again, and I fully expect second waves come fall/winter in other countries that locked down hard unless a vaccine comes.

We will be able to make that "death toll" call next year, but it was too early to excoriate their approach given their specific circumstances back in April/May or even now.
 
mgp said:
Cain was a warrior for their cause of disinformation right up until the end.

23 hours ago:

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I think his commentary surrounding masks and social distancing was reprehensible. His Twitter account appeared to have been run by his staff and he still is responsible for what is posted, but this vaccine hesitancy is warranted in my view.

Context is important - I’m far from an anti-vaxxer, my kids have had all their vaccines, and I get the flu jab every year (along with anything else I’m due for). That being said, I think it’s natural for people to be wary of rushing out to get a vaccine that is for a coronavirus when no other vaccine for that class of virus has ever been created, in 1/4 the time any safe/effective vaccine has ever been developed.

A lot is unknown about mRNA vaccines (like the Moderna and Pfizer ones being tested as opposed to the Oxford or Valneva ones), and if that is what is released it will be the first of its type released in an absurdly short amount of time. Because of this, I will be hesitant to get one right away. SARS-CoV-2 disguises itself as human RNA (SARS-CoV-2 disguises its own genetic material to facilitate infection). There is some concern about long term effects (sound familiar?) of the autoimmune variety that might not be evident until months after inoculation.

Given the IFR of my age (34) and health (regular extensive bloodwork, no comorbidities) is <0.05% and the risk of adverse reaction is unquantifiable, I’d hope others would be understanding of my reticence to hurry up and get jabbed.

This is not to say that I will definitely wait to get a vaccine if the information from the Phase 3 clinical trials show the risks of adverse effects are less than any adverse effects of me or someone who I have close contact with on a regular basis has of getting seriously ill from the virus, but if I took this poll I'd probably be counted among the 70% dumb-dumb headed hillbillies.
 
Yeah, I am a cautiously calculated 70%er, as well. Seems prudent to me and makes sure there's immediate avaialbility for people who have a real need, anyways. There's really nothing wrong with the statistic but the spin around it is the matter of discussion.
 
It's so strange to me to see people say "I don't wanna be someone's guinea pig!"

like.... there are currently several stages of trials with thousands of people who are already doing that. When they approve and mass produce they are saying that it is safe and effective for mass use. People are idiots.

debianlinux said:
Yeah, I am a cautiously calculated 70%er, as well. Seems prudent to me and makes sure there's immediate availability for people who have a real need, anyways. There's really nothing wrong with the statistic but the spin around it is the matter of discussion.
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This is the only thing that makes sense^ if the supply is short, let those have it first who really need it.
 
wokeupnew said:
It's so strange to me to see people say "I don't wanna be someone's guinea pig!"

like.... there are currently several stages of trials with thousands of people who are already doing that. When they approve and mass produce they are saying that it is safe and effective for mass use. People are idiots.



This is the only thing that makes sense^ if the supply is short, let those have it first who really need it.
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I don't see myself as an idiot for taking a measured approach with my health, but you have every right to make your own choice with your body.

Who is "they"? Pharmaceutical companies that get demonized 99% of the time? I don't think there is any conspiracy or anyone is seeking to do harm, but to pretend a vaccine isn't being developed under TREMENDOUS pressure in RECORD time and saying categorically that there will be zero longer term effects for anyone that might take months to show up is naive.
 
Goatfish said:
I don't see myself as an idiot for taking a measured approach with my health, but you have every right to make your own choice with your body.

Who is "they"? Pharmaceutical companies that get demonized 99% of the time? I don't think there is any conspiracy or anyone is seeking to do harm, but to pretend a vaccine isn't being developed under TREMENDOUS pressure in RECORD time and saying categorically that there will be zero longer term effects for anyone that might take months to show up is naive.
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The FDA is they. The Pharmaceutical companies don't approve the drug.
 
dhodo said:
The FDA is they. The Pharmaceutical companies don't approve the drug.
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And there is pressure on the FDA to approve as well. I have absolutely no clue what the percentage of side effects are "acceptable" in a clinical trial in order to approve a drug for mass production, but it's something I'll want to look into before I decide I'll be first in line to inoculate a possibly first of its kind vaccine for a virus that I have >99.95% chance of surviving.
 
Goatfish said:
And there is pressure on the FDA to approve as well. I have absolutely no clue what the percentage of side effects are "acceptable" in a clinical trial in order to approve a drug for mass production, but it's something I'll want to look into before I decide I'll be first in line to inoculate a possibly first of its kind vaccine for a virus that I have >99.95% chance of surviving.
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Just say you don't trust the FDA to do their job I guess. Not sure why you feel that way. The only resources you will have are the same studies they will consider, just like all other drugs that are approved. I think assuming the FDA is going to cut corners before the fact is fear mongering.
 
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