R.I.P. VMP Forum

I missed the pride convo because I wasn't getting notifications for this thread. But I have thoughts!

I am sick of my community's struggles being the flavor of the month only for marketing/advancing the brand purposes. And then come July 1, POOF! All of those new found "allies" disappear.

No. Just no. My community struggles all year. Not just in June. The community needs support all year.

VMP has not had a good track record with the LGBTQ community. And sure, they have to start somewhere, so ok, a VMP hat with some rainbow-ish colors on it may be a fine place to start. But it was centered on VMP instead of on how to support the community. Why not silently partner with a charity and donate? Why not seek out a LGBTQ artist to design a shirt? Why not have all the June AOTMs be by LGBTQ artists? There are so many ways to support the LGBTQ community. They did the bare minimum. And they did it for the cookie/compliment - as in the "oh look at how great VMP is".

Be an ally for the sake of the other person, not to make yourself feel better. Center the LGBTQ community, not yourself.
 
Indymisanthrope said:
I’ll actually take the opposing view here and give them the benefit of the doubt on this score. I don’t think the company promotes the all-in-ones beyond their promo imagery, a lot of which is outsourced to marketing/production vendors. They want people to have decent systems. But I see it like I see the case of my elementary school librarian calling my mom to complain that I was only reading books about dragons. One, none of her damn business. Two, I was reading twice as much as any other kid in the class, even if it was about dragons. If the choice is between somebody being scared to dip their toes into the world of vinyl because they don’t know where to start, or playing some records on an approachable machine that appeals to them...you know, man, whatever. I played the HELL out of some records on an old Fisher Price turntable as a kid. Did I get the *best* audio experience from that Ewoks Adventure storybook record? Hell no. Did I damage the records a bit? For sure. But I had fun & enjoyed it, and it gave me good memories. Would I encourage someone to buy a Crosley today? No way. But if they have one, hey...I hope they get lots of enjoyment out of it. The only thing I have ever 100% agreed with Vinyl Junkies on is that the records are meant to be played.
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I agree. I think they want to appeal to everyone and if the image of you easily playing records on your bedroom tree stump table gets you to subscribe they will take it.

One of the biggest things I hear from people who want to get into collecting/listening to vinyl is "I don't know how" or I don't want to buy a bunch of equipment, etc.

It can be a way over the threshold for some people to get crosleys and start collecting and I say more power to them.
 
tonythegamer said:
Torres, Lapsley, and Blessed Feathers are the three cheapest albums on Discogs.

https://www.discogs.com/Torres-Sprinter/release/6993353

https://www.discogs.com/Låpsley-Long-Way-Home/release/8230301

https://www.discogs.com/Blessed-Feathers-There-Will-Be-No-Sad-Tomorrow/release/7519355

Here's a list of previous ROTMs that are sub 20$ as well:

https://www.discogs.com/Kevin-Morby-City-Music/release/10422791

https://www.discogs.com/St-Vincent-Masseduction/release/11130348

https://www.discogs.com/Moses-Sumney-Aromanticism/release/10893509

https://www.discogs.com/Nils-Frahm-Spaces/release/7836612

https://www.discogs.com/Wilco-AM/release/7339202

https://www.discogs.com/Four-Tet-Pink/release/7467715

https://www.discogs.com/Clipse-Lord-Willin/release/11978254

https://www.discogs.com/The-Books-The-Lemon-Of-Pink/release/9332526

https://www.discogs.com/The-National-Boxer/release/10689734

https://www.discogs.com/Hot-Chip-In-Our-Heads/release/7112398 (this one's 5$ listing is for one that only says it has the first disc, but after that the listings go up to like 15$)

https://www.discogs.com/Queen-Latifah-All-Hail-The-Queen/release/12339174

https://www.discogs.com/Mavis-Staples-Mavis-Staples/release/12909387

https://www.discogs.com/The-Silvertones-Silver-Bullets/release/12235645

https://www.discogs.com/Koko-Taylor-I-Got-What-It-Takes/release/11544033

https://www.discogs.com/Ayalew-Mesfin-Hasabe-My-Worries/release/11544269

https://www.discogs.com/Betty-Davis-Betty-Davis/release/10549758

https://www.discogs.com/Tennis-Yours-Conditionally-/release/9954508

https://www.discogs.com/Glass-Animals-How-To-Be-A-Human-Being/release/9040458

https://www.discogs.com/Wells-Fargo-Watch-Out/release/8635268

https://www.discogs.com/Menomena-Friend-And-Foe/release/6883190

https://www.discogs.com/Perfume-Genius-Too-Bright/release/6300695

https://www.discogs.com/Big-Bill-Broonzy-Big-Bill-Broonzy-Sings-Folk-Songs/release/8067357

Records that are sub $20 initially, but might go over $20 with shipping:

https://www.discogs.com/Townes-Van-Zandt-For-The-Sake-Of-The-Song/release/12617233

https://www.discogs.com/Loretta-Lynn-Coal-Miners-Daughter/release/13467992

https://www.discogs.com/Sarah-Webster-Fabio-Jujus-Alchemy-Of-The-Blues/release/12478292

https://www.discogs.com/Mitski-Be-The-Cowboy/release/12339557

https://www.discogs.com/Little-Simz-A-Curious-Tale-Of-Trials-Persons/release/11396645

https://www.discogs.com/Miles-Davis-Sorcerer/release/11256032

https://www.discogs.com/Open-Mike-Eagle-Unapologetic-Art-Rap/release/12235671

https://www.discogs.com/Little-Milton-Waiting-For-Little-Milton/release/11266836

https://www.discogs.com/My-Morning-Jacket-Z/release/8883442

https://www.discogs.com/BadBadNotGood-IV/release/8753882

https://www.discogs.com/Youth-Lagoon-The-Year-Of-Hibernation/release/6522437

https://www.discogs.com/JAGUERRA-Hue/release/5786135 (this one is just barely over 20$ for the initial price)

https://www.discogs.com/RL-Burnside-Too-Bad-Jim/release/6190477

https://www.discogs.com/The-Ben-Webster-Quintet-Soulville/release/6514340 (at 20$ exactly lol)

https://www.discogs.com/Main-Source-Breaking-Atoms/release/9816263 (this listing is only sub 20$ for a misprinted version, so be wary of that)

https://www.discogs.com/Flying-Lotus-Cosmogramma/release/13021889 (at 20$ exactly lol)

https://www.discogs.com/Arctic-Monkeys-Whatever-People-Say-I-Am-Thats-What-Im-Not/release/11826116 (at 20$ exactly lol)

Notice how a good majority of these are ones that are still in stock? Smh VMP.
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Good work done here ! Nice effort
 
Teeeee said:
I missed the pride convo because I wasn't getting notifications for this thread. But I have thoughts!

I am sick of my community's struggles being the flavor of the month only for marketing/advancing the brand purposes. And then come July 1, POOF! All of those new found "allies" disappear.

No. Just no. My community struggles all year. Not just in June. The community needs support all year.

VMP has not had a good track record with the LGBTQ community. And sure, they have to start somewhere, so ok, a VMP hat with some rainbow-ish colors on it may be a fine place to start. But it was centered on VMP instead of on how to support the community. Why not silently partner with a charity and donate? Why not seek out a LGBTQ artist to design a shirt? Why not have all the June AOTMs be by LGBTQ artists? There are so many ways to support the LGBTQ community. They did the bare minimum. And they did it for the cookie/compliment - as in the "oh look at how great VMP is".

Be an ally for the sake of the other person, not to make yourself feel better. Center the LGBTQ community, not yourself.
Click to expand...

Yeah Lazy effort / marketing ploy

Like this idea : "Why not have all the June AOTMs be by LGBTQ artists"
 
Teeeee said:
I missed the pride convo because I wasn't getting notifications for this thread. But I have thoughts!

I am sick of my community's struggles being the flavor of the month only for marketing/advancing the brand purposes. And then come July 1, POOF! All of those new found "allies" disappear.

No. Just no. My community struggles all year. Not just in June. The community needs support all year.

VMP has not had a good track record with the LGBTQ community. And sure, they have to start somewhere, so ok, a VMP hat with some rainbow-ish colors on it may be a fine place to start. But it was centered on VMP instead of on how to support the community. Why not silently partner with a charity and donate? Why not seek out a LGBTQ artist to design a shirt? Why not have all the June AOTMs be by LGBTQ artists? There are so many ways to support the LGBTQ community. They did the bare minimum. And they did it for the cookie/compliment - as in the "oh look at how great VMP is".

Be an ally for the sake of the other person, not to make yourself feel better. Center the LGBTQ community, not yourself.
Click to expand...
There were SO many opportunities for them to make it about the community and not VMP and yet again, they screwed it up. Even if they don't want to make all 3 AOTMs LGBTQ artists (which is a fantastic idea by the way), then commission the art prints to be my LGBTQ artists. Donate portions of all sales to charities. Press a bunch of exclusives by LGBTQ artists and give proceeds to charity. Make a t-shirt, like you said, designed by artists in the community.

Instead they tossed a rainbow on their logo, put it on a hat and said proceeds will go to charity. Let's be real...how many people are inspired to buy that hat?

It really is a shame that companies take advantage of things like this for corporate profit instead of true, honest intentions and then like you said, disappear once that PR visibility disappears.
 
MikeH said:
There were SO many opportunities for them to make it about the community and not VMP and yet again, they screwed it up. Even if they don't want to make all 3 AOTMs LGBTQ artists (which is a fantastic idea by the way), then commission the art prints to be my LGBTQ artists. Donate portions of all sales to charities. Press a bunch of exclusives by LGBTQ artists and give proceeds to charity. Make a t-shirt, like you said, designed by artists in the community.

Instead they tossed a rainbow on their logo, put it on a hat and said proceeds will go to charity. Let's be real...how many people are inspired to buy that hat?

It really is a shame that companies take advantage of things like this for corporate profit instead of true, honest intentions and then like you said, disappear once that PR visibility disappears.
Click to expand...
I did this workbook last month and found that I learned not only about how I affect POC and how to be a better ally, but I found that I could apply what I learned to any marginalized part of society. It is called the "Me and White Supremacy Workbook" by Layla F. Saad. It was HARD work. But I feel it was absolutely necessary. I only mention this because, yes, on the face of it, the VMP rainbow hat is a good thing. But when one really digs in, like this workbook asks you to, one really sees that it isn't a good thing.

I highly recommend the workbook. It was free to download on Layla's site, I haven't checked if it still is. I know she wrote a book about it that will be published soon, so not sure if the book has usurped the free download. And if anyone does decide to go through the workbook, I found it really helpful to do it with someone. So you can bounce your thoughts and queries off of each other.
 
Ethos99 said:
I agree. I think they want to appeal to everyone and if the image of you easily playing records on your bedroom tree stump table gets you to subscribe they will take it.

One of the biggest things I hear from people who want to get into collecting/listening to vinyl is "I don't know how" or I don't want to buy a bunch of equipment, etc.

It can be a way over the threshold for some people to get crosleys and start collecting and I say more power to them.
Click to expand...
I know Crosleys get a lot of hate from people, but for some people, it's the easiest way to get into vinyl collecting. And since it's an expensive hobby, some people want to have a cheap and affordable entry point to see if they actually want to pursue it or not long-term. The idea of it seems cool, but I know a lot of people that just end up not listening to records all the time. I started off with a shitty cheap record player and when I found myself using it all the time, I saved money and upgraded. Not everybody starting out can afford to drop $300-$400 on a starter turntable. Everybody has to start somewhere.
 
MikeH said:
I know Crosleys get a lot of hate from people, but for some people, it's the easiest way to get into vinyl collecting. And since it's an expensive hobby, some people want to have a cheap and affordable entry point to see if they actually want to pursue it or not long-term. The idea of it seems cool, but I know a lot of people that just end up not listening to records all the time. I started off with a shitty cheap record player and when I found myself using it all the time, I saved money and upgraded. Not everybody starting out can afford to drop $300-$400 on a starter turntable. Everybody has to start somewhere.
Click to expand...

Its a fair point - But i also think with some help those people can spend only a little bit more and perhaps not waste all that money spent on records (lets face it - its not cheap) And keep records in good order.

My first system was entirely second hand and sourced pretty quickly

ok so maybe prices have increased but still places to find recievers etc.

I got the following

Dual 505 turntable (about£60)
JVC 1980s receiver (boxed and looked lovely - i still use the radio on it) £60

And a pair of floorstanding speakers fr ebay (Aural Envelopes) - heavy on bass but ok - Actually I paid nothing for them as they were smashed about in shipping and I was given them - I did a damn good repair job tho. I also repaired a broken connection on one tweeter with a tube of electric paint - Lasted until i gave speakers away (still working too)

So apart from a new needle and some cable brush etc etc. I was up and running for under £200 ......and I knew nothing during this period - just "google was my friend"
Anyhow I'm sure it sounded much better than a Crossley. If people are prepared to make the effort you can do it alone and with next to no knowledge.
I checked on Ebay and could find a number of second hand speaker options under £60 ! so its still doable.
 
tonythegamer said:
Torres, Lapsley, and Blessed Feathers are the three cheapest albums on Discogs.

https://www.discogs.com/Torres-Sprinter/release/6993353

https://www.discogs.com/Låpsley-Long-Way-Home/release/8230301

https://www.discogs.com/Blessed-Feathers-There-Will-Be-No-Sad-Tomorrow/release/7519355

Here's a list of previous ROTMs that are sub 20$ as well:

https://www.discogs.com/Kevin-Morby-City-Music/release/10422791

https://www.discogs.com/St-Vincent-Masseduction/release/11130348

https://www.discogs.com/Moses-Sumney-Aromanticism/release/10893509

https://www.discogs.com/Nils-Frahm-Spaces/release/7836612

https://www.discogs.com/Wilco-AM/release/7339202

https://www.discogs.com/Four-Tet-Pink/release/7467715

https://www.discogs.com/Clipse-Lord-Willin/release/11978254

https://www.discogs.com/The-Books-The-Lemon-Of-Pink/release/9332526

https://www.discogs.com/The-National-Boxer/release/10689734

https://www.discogs.com/Hot-Chip-In-Our-Heads/release/7112398 (this one's 5$ listing is for one that only says it has the first disc, but after that the listings go up to like 15$)

https://www.discogs.com/Queen-Latifah-All-Hail-The-Queen/release/12339174

https://www.discogs.com/Mavis-Staples-Mavis-Staples/release/12909387

https://www.discogs.com/The-Silvertones-Silver-Bullets/release/12235645

https://www.discogs.com/Koko-Taylor-I-Got-What-It-Takes/release/11544033

https://www.discogs.com/Ayalew-Mesfin-Hasabe-My-Worries/release/11544269

https://www.discogs.com/Betty-Davis-Betty-Davis/release/10549758

https://www.discogs.com/Tennis-Yours-Conditionally-/release/9954508

https://www.discogs.com/Glass-Animals-How-To-Be-A-Human-Being/release/9040458

https://www.discogs.com/Wells-Fargo-Watch-Out/release/8635268

https://www.discogs.com/Menomena-Friend-And-Foe/release/6883190

https://www.discogs.com/Perfume-Genius-Too-Bright/release/6300695

https://www.discogs.com/Big-Bill-Broonzy-Big-Bill-Broonzy-Sings-Folk-Songs/release/8067357

Records that are sub $20 initially, but might go over $20 with shipping:

https://www.discogs.com/Townes-Van-Zandt-For-The-Sake-Of-The-Song/release/12617233

https://www.discogs.com/Loretta-Lynn-Coal-Miners-Daughter/release/13467992

https://www.discogs.com/Sarah-Webster-Fabio-Jujus-Alchemy-Of-The-Blues/release/12478292

https://www.discogs.com/Mitski-Be-The-Cowboy/release/12339557

https://www.discogs.com/Little-Simz-A-Curious-Tale-Of-Trials-Persons/release/11396645

https://www.discogs.com/Miles-Davis-Sorcerer/release/11256032

https://www.discogs.com/Open-Mike-Eagle-Unapologetic-Art-Rap/release/12235671

https://www.discogs.com/Little-Milton-Waiting-For-Little-Milton/release/11266836

https://www.discogs.com/My-Morning-Jacket-Z/release/8883442

https://www.discogs.com/BadBadNotGood-IV/release/8753882

https://www.discogs.com/Youth-Lagoon-The-Year-Of-Hibernation/release/6522437

https://www.discogs.com/JAGUERRA-Hue/release/5786135 (this one is just barely over 20$ for the initial price)

https://www.discogs.com/RL-Burnside-Too-Bad-Jim/release/6190477

https://www.discogs.com/The-Ben-Webster-Quintet-Soulville/release/6514340 (at 20$ exactly lol)

https://www.discogs.com/Main-Source-Breaking-Atoms/release/9816263 (this listing is only sub 20$ for a misprinted version, so be wary of that)

https://www.discogs.com/Flying-Lotus-Cosmogramma/release/13021889 (at 20$ exactly lol)

https://www.discogs.com/Arctic-Monkeys-Whatever-People-Say-I-Am-Thats-What-Im-Not/release/11826116 (at 20$ exactly lol)

Notice how a good majority of these are ones that are still in stock? Smh VMP.
Click to expand...

That's an interesting list. I would never have bought Spaces, Long Way Home, Boxer, Betty Davis or Silver Bullets and I really love those records- Spaces in particular is my absolute favourite AOTM bar none. I tend to give the curation a fair amount of credit because there are a number of albums like that that have featured that see a lot of use with me. Admittedly, there are quite a few on that list that don't see heavy rotation too.
 
MikeH said:
I know Crosleys get a lot of hate from people, but for some people, it's the easiest way to get into vinyl collecting. And since it's an expensive hobby, some people want to have a cheap and affordable entry point to see if they actually want to pursue it or not long-term. The idea of it seems cool, but I know a lot of people that just end up not listening to records all the time. I started off with a shitty cheap record player and when I found myself using it all the time, I saved money and upgraded. Not everybody starting out can afford to drop $300-$400 on a starter turntable. Everybody has to start somewhere.
Click to expand...
Yes, especially for teenagers and college age folks with limited space and very small budget. It’s an entry point and photos of people using all in ones make it seem less scary. I am all for that.

But as I said earlier in the thread, a variety of setups in their ads would be good. It shows what’s possible and what’s achievable down the line if it’s a hobby they want to stick with.
 
Ed Selley said:
That's an interesting list. I would never have bought Spaces, Long Way Home, Boxer, Betty Davis or Silver Bullets and I really love those records- Spaces in particular is my absolute favourite AOTM bar none. I tend to give the curation a fair amount of credit because there are a number of albums like that that have featured that see a lot of use with me. Admittedly, there are quite a few on that list that don't see heavy rotation too.
Click to expand...

Spaces was a big hit with me too !
Ive stopped spinning ti - gonna get back on that.
 
A very (very) long time ago some thought was given to using my two armed TT for some of the shots but ignoring the practicality aspects (little ones, like me being in a different country for example), there were some more practical considerations;

- Where's the boundary between aspirational and elitist? Are you alienating more people than you bring in by suddenly featuring a $5k+ TT?
- Is the company getting the free publicity by having their equipment feature going to do anything beneficial with it?
- Does it shoot well in a social media context? (And a lot of high end gear really doesn't)
- Does it take focus away from the record?

Ultimately, it fell by the wayside. I think even the GT modded Rega doesn't feature any more.
 
Ethos99 said:
I agree. I think they want to appeal to everyone and if the image of you easily playing records on your bedroom tree stump table gets you to subscribe they will take it.

One of the biggest things I hear from people who want to get into collecting/listening to vinyl is "I don't know how" or I don't want to buy a bunch of equipment, etc.

It can be a way over the threshold for some people to get crosleys and start collecting and I say more power to them.
Click to expand...

I won a Crosley at a holiday party in 2016. Now I have a legit vinyl habit a (slightly) better setup and am passing down the Crosley to my kids so they can join in the fun with some dollar bin records they can pick out. Everyone has gotta start somewhere...

I remember getting a VMP membership as a gift that year and finding the old place soon thereafter. Not sure I would have hung around if casual scorn of people like me was as prevalent as I’ve seen around here the last couple weeks. Sure, maybe VMP is focused more on a certain demographic that isn’t so sensitive to price/quality issues. Maybe we can make that point without being so derisive about those people?
 
MikeH said:
Instead they tossed a rainbow on their logo, put it on a hat and said proceeds will go to charity. Let's be real...how many people are inspired to buy that hat?

It really is a shame that companies take advantage of things like this for corporate profit instead of true, honest intentions and then like you said, disappear once that PR visibility disappears.
Click to expand...
They sold out of the hat and shirt. People love opportunities to support a cause via minimum effort and risk. It's not like the VMP logo is even using an identifiable pride rainbow.
 
LG&M said:
I won a Crosley at a holiday party in 2016. Now I have a legit vinyl habit a (slightly) better setup and am passing down the Crosley to my kids so they can join in the fun with some dollar bin records they can pick out. Everyone has gotta start somewhere...

I remember getting a VMP membership as a gift that year and finding the old place soon thereafter. Not sure I would have hung around if casual scorn of people like me was as prevalent as I’ve seen around here the last couple weeks. Sure, maybe VMP is focused more on a certain demographic that isn’t so sensitive to price/quality issues. Maybe we can make that point without being so derisive about those people?
Click to expand...
There's a huge difference between being constructive and helpful when talking about somebody else's setup and just being an asshat haha. I have learned tons from people being kind enough to give recommendations on setups, specs, upgrades, etc. I'm still learning an insane amount and doubt I'll even begin to scratch the surface on what there is to know about audiophile equipment. Getting a turntable (even an entry level one when I first started out) got me way more into music and helped me get into Jazz and other genres I wasn't particularly into at the time. It's a different music experience for me than opening up iTunes or Spotify.

I think it's awesome when people get their first turntable, no matter what it is. I have fond memories of "blasting" my parents' Beach Boys albums on my fisher price turntable when I was a kid. My 1st grade teacher used to have "Motown Mondays" where she would bring in Motown records and play them during breaks in our class. I thought it was the coolest thing ever and she was using some all-in-one beat up record player.

Are Crosleys the best turntable out there? Not really. Would I spin a rare record or an expensive pressing on one? Probably not...but most people who are relatively new to vinyl aren't buying those records at first. And if you're enjoying the music then so what? If you're still regularly playing records after a year or so, then there are lots of upgrades that will make the experience more enjoyable and still affordable. I personally think it's a bit silly to drop a ton of money on your first setup because a lot of people don't end up sticking with the hobby long-term.

I love that you are handing the Crosley down to your kids. Aside from it being rad, it's a cool experience to go record hunting with your kids if they are into it and having family time sitting down and listening and dancing to music.
 
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