The Dark Side; Digital audio equipment recommendations and setup.

MikeH said:
I'm with Joe, @Mather . Since you can add an external DAC later and the Bluesound does MQA, I'd just rock the Bluesound and connect via RCA cables to your amp. If you find that you're using the streaming a ton, then look for an external DAC that can do MQA later on. If you, for some reason, hate streaming, then just re-sell the Bluesound. And if Qobuz ends up coming to Canada later, then your external DAC options open up a little bit since you wouldn't have to get something that has MQA support.
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Yeah or if he can Qobuz down the line it opens up connecting to the DAC in his ARCAM again too as they’re just FLAC files. In that scenario I’d experiment there first before spending the extra on an external as I’m sure it will be a decent bit of kit in an amp of that class. The DAC in my PS Audio preamp is miles ahead of anything digital that I had heard before I got it!
 
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MikeH said:
Personally, I'd use the internal DAC for now and make sure you use streaming enough before also adding the cost of an external DAC. I think the Node does MQA so should be good on that front if you're using Tidal.

I believe you need to use the RCA outputs if you're using the internal DAC. I think the optical out is only if you're using an external DAC, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong!
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Follow Mike's advice to start, get setup and comfortable with streaming then you can look at the likes of Denafrips, Chord, Topping D-70 Dac's, cable demo's, down the road.
 
Thanks guys. The issue is I have this kick ass system but due to space constraints I'm currently limited to only about 600 albums that can truly take advantage of it. Since I have no other high quality audio options running into it. Just vinyl. That seems silly. So as much as I don't REALLY want to go the streaming route for fear that I'll neglect my vinyl, I think I really have to at this point. It makes no sense to have this system and not have the option of playing a larger library of music on it.

Other question, I see the BlueSound Node 3 has a subwoofer out. Would this just be for people directly attaching a sub to the node? I presume I can ignore that since my sub is connected through my AVR?
 
Mather said:
Thanks guys. The issue is I have this kick ass system but due to space constraints I'm currently limited to only about 600 albums that can truly take advantage of it. Since I have no other high quality audio options running into it. Just vinyl. That seems silly. So as much as I don't REALLY want to go the streaming route for fear that I'll neglect my vinyl, I think I really have to at this point. It makes no sense to have this system and not have the option of playing a larger library of music on it.

Other question, I see the BlueSound Node 3 has a subwoofer out. Would this just be for people directly attaching a sub to the node? I presume I can ignore that since my sub is connected through my AVR?
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That’s how I read it. I’d imagine that’s there for the crew that are connecting their node directly to powered speakers and want to add a sub too.

Yeah I’m beginning to run into space constraints too. I have room for about 1,200 I think and I’m approaching 1,000 now. I’d quite happily own 2,000 to 3,000 long term if I had more space. Streaming does offer a nice counterpart to vinyl, not just for occasionally listening to albums/songs you don’t need to own but also for pre-listening to make that decision on what you need to own and for parties it’s so much handier to make a digital playlist, stick it on random and let it go.
 
Okay so if I'm just going with the onboard DAC on the Node 3.... for best quality audio out am I going RCA or Digital Audio coax?
 
Joe Mac said:
It’s only RCA for an analogue signal. Digital Coax bypasses the internal DAC and sends a digital signal that then needs a DAC to decript it.
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Sigh... what's a good option for RCA. I can't do BIS again. I no longer have the hookup there so it would cost like $1000 for one meter of my existing VIVAT RCAs.
 
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Mather said:
Sigh... what's a good option for RCA. I can't do BIS again. I no longer have the hookup there so it would cost like $1000 for one meter of my existing RCAs.
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For value the BlueJeans stuff can’t be beaten. I’m running Van Den Hull “The Wave” cables which I really like. I think they were around €120 a meter. Honestly though I’d likely have bought the BlueJeans for much less had I known about them then. You’re going to get lots of different answers from every different person here though because that’s the nature of analogue cables lol.
 
Mather said:
Sigh... what's a good option for RCA. I can't do BIS again. I no longer have the hookup there so it would cost like $1000 for one meter of my existing VIVAT RCAs.
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I'm in the camp of cables making a difference, but I'm also of the mindset that overspending isn't needed. That being said, I'm with @Joe Mac on the BlueJean cables, that's all I have throughout both systems and have had 0 issues, no hums, good fit, nicely shielded..........and you can't beat the price ;)
 
AnthonyI said:
I'm in the camp of cables making a difference, but I'm also of the mindset that overspending isn't needed. That being said, I'm with @Joe Mac on the BlueJean cables, that's all I have throughout both systems and have had 0 issues, no hums, good fit, nicely shielded..........and you can't beat the price ;)
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Yeah it's strange that they don't really seem to sell it in Canada. So unfortunately you have to add shipping to the cost as well when it comes to that one. But it'll likely the way I'll go, but Analog Seduction is great and they have the Van Den Hul River and ship really cheap so that are both good options. But speakers first... THEN Node.


EDIT: Actually, looking now it appears Amazon Prime is selling Blue Jeans cable. A little wary since lord knows where they get their products from, could very well be fake. But it's shipped by Amazon so likely not. Anyhow, that's new.
 
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Mather said:
Yeah it's strange that they don't really seem to sell it in Canada. So unfortunately you have to add shipping to the cost as well when it comes to that one. But it'll likely the way I'll go, but Analog Seduction is great and they have the Van Den Hul River and ship really cheap so that are both good options. But speakers first... THEN Node.
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Van den Hull cables are really nicely made. They’re expensive but I do like them. The first RCA of theirs that I bought was a single of “The Integration Hybrid”. When I went back to get the rest they were sold out so I bought the cheaper “The Wave”. I could hear no difference so I flogged the Integration one and went for the Wave ones for all my RCA.
 
Joe Mac said:
That’s how I read it. I’d imagine that’s there for the crew that are connecting their node directly to powered speakers and want to add a sub too.

Yeah I’m beginning to run into space constraints too. I have room for about 1,200 I think and I’m approaching 1,000 now. I’d quite happily own 2,000 to 3,000 long term if I had more space. Streaming does offer a nice counterpart to vinyl, not just for occasionally listening to albums/songs you don’t need to own but also for pre-listening to make that decision on what you need to own and for parties it’s so much handier to make a digital playlist, stick it on random and let it go.
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The playlist thing is something I've never really done, which is probably a must for digital listening. On Tidal it's not always that straightforward finding what you want on MQA quality. Maybe a thought for another N&G thread, Definitive Audiophile playlists?
 
Andy said:
The playlist thing is something I've never really done, which is probably a must for digital listening. On Tidal it's not always that straightforward finding what you want on MQA quality. Maybe a thought for another N&G thread, Definitive Audiophile playlists?
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I use it a lot for driving. Even if it’s just throwing 3 or 4 full albums in a playlist to spin through so I don’t have to take my eye off the road.

For parties it doesn’t even need to be audiophile. We used to give out a link to everyone coming to a shared Spotify playlist and tell them to add 4 or 5 of their own. Vinyl is nice if you’ve 3 or 4 people over for a dinner party to show off a little bit but with a proper party you just want the music on and forget about it so you can circulate and have a laugh. You could do similar for Tidal or Qobuz, I’d not necessarily be having kittens over whether it was hi res or not in that scenario.
 
Joe Mac said:
I use it a lot for driving. Even if it’s just throwing 3 or 4 full albums in a playlist to spin through so I don’t have to take my eye off the road.

For parties it doesn’t even need to be audiophile. We used to give out a link to everyone coming to a shared Spotify playlist and tell them to add 4 or 5 of their own. Vinyl is nice if you’ve 3 or 4 people over for a dinner party to show off a little bit but with a proper party you just want the music on and forget about it so you can circulate and have a laugh. You could do similar for Tidal or Qobuz, I’d not necessarily be having kittens over whether it was hi res or not in that scenario.
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And if you go the Roon route you can build playlists in there that combine streaming with your own digital files.

The one thing that I hate about streaming, especially with jazz titles, is that there are usually bonus tracks on the album. When I stream an album trying to decide if I am going to buy the vinyl, I just want to hear the original album. Blue Note is notorious for this. The only way to hear the album in its original sequence is by building a playlist. Just a personal pet peeve of mine that drives me bonkers.
 
Mather said:
Thanks guys. The issue is I have this kick ass system but due to space constraints I'm currently limited to only about 600 albums that can truly take advantage of it. Since I have no other high quality audio options running into it. Just vinyl. That seems silly. So as much as I don't REALLY want to go the streaming route for fear that I'll neglect my vinyl, I think I really have to at this point. It makes no sense to have this system and not have the option of playing a larger library of music on it.

Other question, I see the BlueSound Node 3 has a subwoofer out. Would this just be for people directly attaching a sub to the node? I presume I can ignore that since my sub is connected through my AVR?
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Find a good balance. Some days I just do not feel like analog, cleaning, etc or you will find some things you like better on digital and vice versa.

If you have your own good digital files the Bluesound will work with those as well. Then you can create your own playlists from those in a good player and not have to rely on streaming 100% for digital. I been collecting cd since the mid eithties, Lossless and ripping to flac since itunes and Squeezebox days

As far as lp storage, purge stuff you are not going to listen too, doubles (pick the best version) etc and make a little room or you can always expand by going vertical, using a closet, wall floor, unused space on bookshelves, crates, etc.
 
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Mather said:
Okay so.. if I was to get a BlueSound Node 3, what's the best option for cabling in terms of quality? Would a simple optical cable do the trick? Do most serious listeners run the node through a better external DAC first?
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Hi @Mather ,

I have a Node 2i (the previous generation) and decided to just keep it simple and use the internal DAC of the Node. I tested it out when I first got it on my downstairs system (HINT 6 & KEF Q350), which is more revealing than my now "main" setup. I tried the following:

"External" DAC
Node 2i -> Coax -> Parasound HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)
Node 2i -> Coax -> Topping D70 -> XLR -> HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)

Internal DAC
Node 2i -> RCA -> HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)
Node 2i -> RCA -> PrimaLuna Evo100

I tested with Roon & BluOS (Bluesound's app). I also tested with Spotify, Qobuz, and Tidal. I couldn't listen for more than around 10 seconds with Tidal + MQA on my previous system, but on my office system, it actually sounds pretty good. I only got Tidal 'cause there was a promo for $50/yr, but once that expires, I'll probably switch to something else.

The Topping D70 is a well-reviewed $500 standalone DAC, and I really couldn't hear any huge differences (it seemed a little smoother), so I think I'd need to spend quite a bit more to notice something worthwhile. I do have a Denafrips Pontus II on order and plan to use it with the Node 2i as the streamer.

I think the Node 2i sounds really good, especially for the price and the relative simplicity of it. I think for the price, quality, and features, it's really hard to beat. I think the app is the weakest link; it's usable/learnable, but it's pretty buggy.
 
tomheo said:
Hi @Mather ,

I have a Node 2i (the previous generation) and decided to just keep it simple and use the internal DAC of the Node. I tested it out when I first got it on my downstairs system (HINT 6 & KEF Q350), which is more revealing than my now "main" setup. I tried the following:

"External" DAC
Node 2i -> Coax -> Parasound HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)
Node 2i -> Coax -> Topping D70 -> XLR -> HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)

Internal DAC
Node 2i -> RCA -> HINT 6 (no huge noticeable differences)
Node 2i -> RCA -> PrimaLuna Evo100

I tested with Roon & BluOS (Bluesound's app). I also tested with Spotify, Qobuz, and Tidal. I couldn't listen for more than around 10 seconds with Tidal + MQA on my previous system, but on my office system, it actually sounds pretty good. I only got Tidal 'cause there was a promo for $50/yr, but once that expires, I'll probably switch to something else.

The Topping D70 is a well-reviewed $500 standalone DAC, and I really couldn't hear any huge differences (it seemed a little smoother), so I think I'd need to spend quite a bit more to notice something worthwhile. I do have a Denafrips Pontus II on order and plan to use it with the Node 2i as the streamer.

I think the Node 2i sounds really good, especially for the price and the relative simplicity of it. I think for the price, quality, and features, it's really hard to beat. I think the app is the weakest link; it's usable/learnable, but it's pretty buggy.
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That's awesome, thanks for the info! From what I'm reading the Node 3 has a slightly upgraded DAC and quite frankly I think it'll be good enough for me. I'm not going to chase the dragon the same way I do with vinyl. So I think what you've noticed is pretty much exactly what I was wanting to hear. I'm sure better DACs will sound incrementally better but I'm not going to drop 500+ on a offboard DAC just to gain 3% better sound. Thanks for the detailed response, cheers.
 
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