Vinyl Me Please (store, exclusives, swaps, etc)

AudioAce said:
Would think they would say it today before it releases tomorrow. Do they do surprise drops?
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Based on previous practices, I would assume there would be some lead time. I can’t recall there eve being at least 12 hours notice prior to a drop of any size let alone a huge release of that nature.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
This might be an unpopular opinion but I feel that flipper’s are the biggest scapegoat in the vinyl collecting community. I feel like “flipping” is and has always been a part of most collecting communities (comic books, trading cards, sneakers, toys, etc...) but for some reason the vinyl collecting community might be the most intolerant of this practice and while I understand the frustration/disappointment that some feel when they miss out on rare/limited releases of their favorite albums only to then find them on the resale market for 2-3 times the MSRP, the vitriol aimed at opportunists seems harsh. Records like many collectibles ebb and flow in value and the individuals flipping are taking advantage of the supply and demand within the collectors marketplace. As collectors, many enjoy rarity and scarcity of limited release, however it’s the limited nature of these release that drive the secondary market. Also, Flippers can list albums for whatever they’d like I doesn’t mean they will sell for that much. As with anything these sellers are trying to establish a floor for what the market is willing to pay. Lots of times the prices on the secondary market will settle down once hype behind a release subsides. I personally have never intentionally flipped records or concert tickets, but I am not opposed to others doing it. Like I said, I get the sour grapes, I just feel there is lots of misdirected anger when things don’t work out. That being said, I do hope that everyone who missed out on The Infamous or any other release eventually finds an affordable copy. Sorry for the diatribe. Carry on.
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When I first started collecting records I went to a Record Store Day and bought about 7 records I wanted . I didn’t know anything about color exclusives or anything so when I found out one of my records was selling for 100s on eBay because of the color I sold it paid for all my other records and bought a standard black copy and still made some money, to take my kid to six flags .Didn’t think anything of until later when I found out on a forum that I was the scum of the universe. Haven’t sold any since but I understand why somebody would.
 
djdavedk said:
Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD.

Look at health care charges, opportunistic gas / food costs, cable/TV/internet, etc.

Healthy capitalism is great. Unfortunately, there's often not a fair playing field; but I suppose this is a conversation for a different thread (Hot Takes?)
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The things you mentioned above are all things you are forced to do (health care) or some consider basic needs where there is not an alternative supplier to control costs (cable/tv/internet). No one is forcing you to buy the overpriced concert ticket or the limited edition vinyl.

There has always been speculation in most hobby collecting and it doesn't make the flippers bad people. If i bought a copy of Avett Brothers - Gleam 2 on vinyl new and could get $600 from a buyer on discogs 10 years later, i wouldn't hesitate for a minute. And would not consider selling it for my purchase price as to not offend anyone.

Too each his own, however i just see it as part of the game up to a point. I think the real problem is VMP letting people buy 5. I dont blame the flippers for taking avantage of VMP.
 
Personally, I have no problem with someone buying one copy of something because they think it might be valuable down the road. I do have a problem with someone buying five copies of something that they think might be valuable down the road.

Ipso facto I have a problem with companies releasing a limited edition of something, then allowing people to buy 5 copies of that thing.
 
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Rahawk2 said:
When I first started collecting records I went to a Record Store Day and bought about 7 records I wanted . I didn’t know anything about color exclusives or anything so when I found out one of my records was selling for 100s on eBay because of the color I sold it paid for all my other records and bought a standard black copy and still made some money, to take my kid to six flags .Didn’t think anything of until later when I found out on a forum that I was the scum of the universe. Haven’t sold any since but I understand why somebody would.
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You didn't buy up a pile of them with the sole intention of flipping them for profit, right?
 
Mather said:
Personally, I have no problem with someone buying one copy of something because they think it might be valuable down the road. I do have a problem with someone buying five copies of something that they think might be valuable down the road.

And ipso facto I have a problem with companies releasing a limited edition of something, then allowing people to buy 5 copies of that thing.
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Exactly, so can we agree its all VMP's fault? :p
 
Rahawk2 said:
When I first started collecting records I went to a Record Store Day and bought about 7 records I wanted . I didn’t know anything about color exclusives or anything so when I found out one of my records was selling for 100s on eBay because of the color I sold it paid for all my other records and bought a standard black copy and still made some money, to take my kid to six flags .Didn’t think anything of until later when I found out on a forum that I was the scum of the universe. Haven’t sold any since but I understand why somebody would.
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Yeah, I have mixed feelings on things like this. If you buy an album solely to flip, you suck and are one of the worst parts about collecting. But if you buy an album for retail with the intention of keeping it and then find out it's selling for $80-100+, I dont really think theres anything wrong with selling it.
I have a copy of The Simple Favor soundtrack I bought from UO for $21 and it's now out of print and selling for over $100 on discogs since there were only 450 pressed. I really like the album and definitely would keep it for $21, but do I like it more than $100? Not so sure about that.
 
Mather said:
Personally, I have no problem with someone buying one copy of something because they think it might be valuable down the road. I do have a problem with someone buying five copies of something that they think might be valuable down the road.

And ipso facto I have a problem with companies releasing a limited edition of something, then allowing people to buy 5 copies of that thing.
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Agreed. I think the biggest issue here (at least for the Mobb Deeb) was allowing people to buy 5. No one needs 5 of that. 2 max seems pretty fair.
 
wynn72 said:
Yeah, I have mixed feelings on things like this. If you buy an album solely to flip, you suck and are one of the worst parts about collecting. But if you buy an album for retail with the intention of keeping it and then find out it's selling for $80-100+, I dont really think theres anything wrong with selling it.
I have a copy of The Simple Favor soundtrack I bought from UO for $21 and it's now out of print and selling for over $100 on discogs since there were only 450 pressed. I really like the album and definitely would keep it for $21, but do I like it more than $100? Not so sure about that.
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Honestly I think reselling records in general would be a pain in the ass. I can sell a record new and it can easily be damaged in shipping , or can have some crackle and pops from a bad pressing that certainly isn’t the shippers fault . Just seems like more headache then it’s worth.
 
My feelings on this are a bit complicated - I find the idea of flipping abhorrent in the abstract, and I get fucking furious* when I can't get something I want because I feel like I lost out to flippers - but their existence is a response to the fact that the items in question are being offered for sale at well below the price that the demand could support, and fundamentally I think that's a good thing. If VMP had initially put this thing up at $100 (which is still where De La Soul is Dead is trading on discogs), we'd all have lost our minds. This has started happening in the ticket markets, with some artists/venues jacking their face prices up into the stratosphere and some sports teams adopting "dynamic pricing" derived from secondary market data, and it generally sucks. The status quo that creates such compelling incentives that someone would decide to spend their time, money and energy buying multiple copies of a Mobb Deep record on ugly colored vinyl and reselling/repacking/reshipping them one by one may not have a lot to recommend it, but it does mean that people at least got a chance to get the thing they wanted at a fair price.

None of this is to defend flippers - again, the notion of putting yourself between genuine fans and their favorite artists/teams/whatever in order to stick them up seems downright sociopathic, and several of the practices that have sprung up around it (such as the use of bots, naked short-selling on StubHub, and artists/venues/promoters handing over blocks of tickets to resellers) are repugnant and should be fought against - but I'm not so sure that the alternatives are actually better.

*This was discussed in the MMJ thread, but after their Red Rocks shows in August, some person (or persons) apparently built a bot that flooded the poster artist's website when he put his stock up for sale the next week. I felt like Vincent Vega after someone keyed his car.
 
I always find it a bit funny when people complain about sellers flipping a limited coloured pressing when a "regular" pressing is readily available. I find it especially hilarious when they then use the discogs comments to bitch about said flippers. I mean at that point do you even care about the music or you just want to have something because of its perceived value without paying the price?

By the way anyone want to sell me the VMP Futuresexlovesounds at a non-flipper price?
 
Rahawk2 said:
Honestly I think reselling records in general would be a pain in the ass. I can sell a record new and it can easily be damaged in shipping , or can have some crackle and pops from a bad pressing that certainly isn’t the shippers fault . Just seems like more headache then it’s worth.
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Yes I agree. The only time I sold one on the internet it got damaged in delivery. It ended up that I refunded the seller whereas to PIF or trade gives much more satisfaction
 
Space Wanderer said:
but their existence is a response to the fact that the items in question are being offered for sale at well below the price that the demand could support, and fundamentally I think that's a good thing.
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That's one way to look at it and is technically true, but it would be just as valid to say that they are producing far less product than demand could support. I blame the producers as much as the flippers, because they are using the limited numbers to stoke FOMO and collectibility as their business model instead of just focusing on delivering a premium product to drive the business model.

I understand that for many people having a limited, numbered edition is the most important part, but that is hard for me to relate to. If there is a readily available standard black pressing of the same thing, then I don't get upset with those producers or flippers really, because for me it is about the music and sound/pressing quality first.
 
dhodo said:
That's one way to look at it and is technically true, but it would be just as valid to say that they are producing far less product than demand could support. I blame the producers as much as the flippers, because they are using the limited numbers to stoke FOMO and collectibility as their business model instead of just focusing on delivering a premium product to drive the business model.

I understand that for many people having a limited, numbered edition is the most important part, but that is hard for me to relate to. If there is a readily available standard black pressing of the same thing, then I don't get upset with those producers or flippers really, because for me it is about the music and sound/pressing quality first.
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It's probably true in this case that they (meaning VMP) produced fewer copies than demand could support, but I'm not sure that's due to a choice they've made (or at least, not due a simple choice). When it comes to vinyl there are real constraints on the supply side, and I imagine they have a more or less fixed number of total records that they can manage to get pressed in a given time period (these Mobb Deep records will probably ship around Easter) which they have to allocate among a bunch of projects. I'd definitely buy the notion that they err on the underside of production numbers in order to "stoke FOMO", but when the supply and demand are this far off that doesn't seem like a good explanation to me. Especially since, anecdotally anyway, it seems like just about every one of these 90's hip hop reissues they've done has sold out quickly, so they couldn't have been taken by surprise.
 
Space Wanderer said:
It's probably true in this case that they (meaning VMP) produced fewer copies than demand could support, but I'm not sure that's due to a choice they've made (or at least, not due a simple choice). When it comes to vinyl there are real constraints on the supply side, and I imagine they have a more or less fixed number of total records that they can manage to get pressed in a given time period (these Mobb Deep records will probably ship around Easter) which they have to allocate among a bunch of projects. I'd definitely buy the notion that they err on the underside of production numbers in order to "stoke FOMO", but when the supply and demand are this far off that doesn't seem like a good explanation to me. Especially since, anecdotally anyway, it seems like just about every one of these 90's hip hop reissues they've done has sold out quickly, so they couldn't have been taken by surprise.
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*cough* approx 30,000 essentials plus side subs every month *cough*
 
Space Wanderer said:
It's probably true in this case that they (meaning VMP) produced fewer copies than demand could support, but I'm not sure that's due to a choice they've made (or at least, not due a simple choice). When it comes to vinyl there are real constraints on the supply side, and I imagine they have a more or less fixed number of total records that they can manage to get pressed in a given time period (these Mobb Deep records will probably ship around Easter) which they have to allocate among a bunch of projects. I'd definitely buy the notion that they err on the underside of production numbers in order to "stoke FOMO", but when the supply and demand are this far off that doesn't seem like a good explanation to me. Especially since, anecdotally anyway, it seems like just about every one of these 90's hip hop reissues they've done has sold out quickly, so they couldn't have been taken by surprise.
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I've never heard of any small companies not being able to press the numbers they want. It seems to be based on how much money they want to put up. Do you have any info on that or is it just an assumption you're making? They press tens of thousands for every record of the month, I'm not sure why this would be different.

They could also repress based on demand but that would probably hurt FOMO marketing strategies.

I don't think it is really up for debate at this point that VMP doesn't have the same priorities as I do about record pressing. Certainly for exclusives. The Mobb Deep is a good example because when asked what pressing this was, they just said, "I don't know, Sony handled it." I think it is crazy that they don't care to know the details of the exclusives they are selling.
 
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