Political Discussion

Sure but no one who would have a shot for President on the D side would tell Israel to stop or have an impact. Support for Israel and support against Israel are both weaponized. There is no middle ground any longer. You can't have nuance. You can't say I support Israel's right to exist but hate what they are doing in Gaza. You're going to lose support regardless of what side you take.

Do you think if Trump was in office during this that any aid would've made it to Gaza? That anyone would've been allowed to leave and return to the US? Do you think any pauses would've been sought by the US under Trump?

My hope is Biden wins and resigns after the first 100 days. Then the Democrats have 3 years to either get behind Kamala or find the next person to take on Trump...because it will be Trump until his body is in the ground.
 
mdmost said:
Sure but no one who would have a shot for President on the D side would tell Israel to stop or have an impact. Support for Israel and support against Israel are both weaponized. There is no middle ground any longer. You can't have nuance. You can't say I support Israel's right to exist but hate what they are doing in Gaza. You're going to lose support regardless of what side you take.

Do you think if Trump was in office during this that any aid would've made it to Gaza? That anyone would've been allowed to leave and return to the US? Do you think any pauses would've been sought by the US under Trump?

My hope is Biden wins and resigns after the first 100 days. Then the Democrats have 3 years to either get behind Kamala or find the next person to take on Trump...because it will be Trump until his body is in the ground.
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There isn't really a middle ground in this circumstance. Israel's existence, as a state, in its current iteration is predicated on the subjugation of the Palestinian people. Biden is trying to please everybody here, but it simply does not work. He's sending money en masse to a government that has called a group of people inhuman animals, and is bombing them indiscriminately as we speak, and ALSO trying to look like the ones looking out for those bombed people by sending a pittance of aid. Nobody should be buying it, and people are justifiably upset.

Also, no offense, but being stuck with a Kamala incumbent, especially by resignation, sounds horrible. Not interested in either of them.
 
mdmost said:
They want the annihilation of Hamas.
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Noble on paper, but extremely misguided.

Not only does Hamas only exist because of Israel, they have been propped up and funding by them for decades. Netanyahu and others are literally on record saying they need Hamas to exist to keep Palestinians and world opinion divided.

And even if this were true, reports suggest that only ~60 Hamas operatives have been killed in the last month. That's a 99% civilian death rate. Worth it?
 
You think those 34% of voters know or care anything about that? They know Hamas killed 1600 Israelies so if that means if all of Gaza is leveled to get to Hamas then that's justified.
 
mdmost said:
You think those 34% of voters know or care anything about that? They know Hamas killed 1600 Israelies so if that means if all of Gaza is leveled to get to Hamas then that's justified.
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To get back to the original point, if Biden doesn't want his numbers to flounder, he could try appealing to the blatant popular majority instead of pretending this is a 50/50 issue (or a 80/20 issue more like)
 
ayayrawn said:
And even if this were true, reports suggest that only ~60 Hamas operatives have been killed in the last month. That's a 99% civilian death rate. Worth it?
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Not to mention you have former US generals saying things in interviews about what Israel should do that are war crimes. Like legit war crimes illegal under international treaties. Like starve all of Gaza into surrender.

And when asked why they think this is okay, they respond with "because this is war".
 
One of the best things my kids pediatricians office did around this was basically telling parents that if you don't want to follow the vaccine protocols they set out including the schedule then you need to find a different office to go to. "You trust us to protect your child and keep them healthy, you should trust us that we would not put your child in harm's way when it comes to vaccines".
 
RenegadeMonster said:
Is it possible that both buses are heading in the wrong direction?
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I mean, I don't think so... I know there is a lot of talk about the Dems have to fight back. I don't necessarily disagree, but I don't want them to stoop to the Right's tactics.

Biden would be fine if the climate allowed for moderates to get work done, but that's not where we are at.

The system needs to implode, but not the way Trump is going about it. I do seriously worry about not only the country but the world. We are not in a good place right now.
 
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