Joe Mac
Well-Known Member
Honestly there are loads of third party companies that do nicer looking plinths with multiple tonearm mounts that you could add to a 10R and a much nicer tonearm(s) and still have change in your pocket.
The Technics Turntable Fan Club - Questions, Advice, Discussion
- Thread starter Turbo
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Honestly there are loads of third party companies that do nicer looking plinths with multiple tonearm mounts that you could add to a 10R and a much nicer tonearm(s) and still have change in your pocket.
Angsty
Well-Known Member
I'm not advocating that anyone should buy the SL-1000R; I'm saying that the Grand Class mid-tier looks remarkably close to the top Reference class flagship, but not equal.
Regarding the SL-1000R tonearm - it's not much to look at but the performance is comparable to much more expensive tonearms. One thing I do trust Technics on is superlative engineering and measurements can help confirm that. Very few people buy turntables/tonearms on measurements alone - it is much more often an experiential decision.
Regarding the SL-1000R tonearm - it's not much to look at but the performance is comparable to much more expensive tonearms. One thing I do trust Technics on is superlative engineering and measurements can help confirm that. Very few people buy turntables/tonearms on measurements alone - it is much more often an experiential decision.
Jbraswell
Well-Known Member
The two biggest design differences between the R and G are the separate power supply and this construction of the tonearm suspension.
"To enable the tonearm to precisely track the record's rotation, Technics has traditionally used the static balance, S-type universal tonearm with a lightweight, high damping magnesium tonearm pipe. The gimbal suspension construction tonearm uses high-precision bearings. Highly skilled Japanese craftsmen handle all assembly and adjustment to achieve a high initial-motion sensitivity to precisely trace the grooves cut into the records. OFC is used for internal wiring, so the music signal relayed from the cartridge is not dampened and the musical energy cut into the record is not lost, thereby producing highly vivid sounds."
Like they say, it cost a bunch of money to chase that final 5-10% of sound improvements.
Angsty
Well-Known Member
From the Stereophile article on the SL-1300G:
"As Bill Voss explained: The 1300G uses the same basic tonearm, with the same bearings and bits as the 1200G, but substitutes an aluminum armtube for the magnesium pipe on the 1200G. And! According to Bill, the only difference between the 9" magnesium arm on the 1200G and the 10" magnesium arm on the SL-1000R is the length. What this means is: Technics makes one tonearm and fits it with three different armtubes to suit the needs of three different turntable models."
"As Bill Voss explained: The 1300G uses the same basic tonearm, with the same bearings and bits as the 1200G, but substitutes an aluminum armtube for the magnesium pipe on the 1200G. And! According to Bill, the only difference between the 9" magnesium arm on the 1200G and the 10" magnesium arm on the SL-1000R is the length. What this means is: Technics makes one tonearm and fits it with three different armtubes to suit the needs of three different turntable models."
mindhead1
Well-Known Member
My question is will I be able to hear the difference in SQ without having both tables side by side and squinting? My instincts tell me no. I'm not saying that the 1000R isn't a beautifully made piece, but I got to think at that price point your into serious diminishing returns territory.
I say this having never heard a really high end TT setup. The best I've heard is my UltraDeck. I'm interested in experimenting with carts thus the 1300G is appealing to me. I looked at the GR before I bought the UltraDeck, but I couldn't get past the DJ look. the 1300G solves that problem.
Jbraswell
Well-Known Member
I think the difference would be noticeable after hearing both tables.
Worth it? Questionable and purely personal opinion.
I think getting something like the G and a reference level cart will leave most everyone pretty much content. Or at least it was pencils down for me.
Lek
New Member
Yeah...the whole pitch slider is just an ugly damned look...oh i might be functional but do not seriously think it is needed on a 4k+ table. I mean in '78 or so i bought and grew up with an SL1800. Had pitch variation and a clean look. Do not understand the design on the 1200's.
In any event.....getting closer daily to pulling the trigger on a 1300g...trigger finger getting itchy....
In any event.....getting closer daily to pulling the trigger on a 1300g...trigger finger getting itchy....
Jbraswell
Well-Known Member
Personal opinion but I think it makes the 1200 look like a very unique sound machine. Industrial and technical to go with the first hand feel. It's all part of the engineering visual of the design.
I do wish I could turn off and on the strobe at will but the machined dots rotating are kind of hypnotizing to watch. Very intelligent how they designed the speed check on these tables.
I guess it all depends on what type of geek you are. I love well engineered stuff so the extra features are appreciated.
displayname
Well-Known Member
I think surrounding equipment is a major factor here. Plug in a G and an R to a $10-20k system, entry level MC cart, and $1-2k phonostage, probably walk away saying you could barely tell the difference.
But do the same test with flagship 6 figure system, a $10k+ cartridge, etc… I bet you feel like the R is a pretty obvious choice.
Things like that aren’t made for normal people, lol
Jbraswell
Well-Known Member
Maybe so but I hate to base sound on price.
Definitely could justify a need for good separates but six figures seems exaggerated.
No doubt it's the target consumer though.
displayname
Well-Known Member
I mean if you're spending $20k on a TT, you're probably spending at least $5k on a cartridge and several thousand on a phonostage. Gets you into a 6 figure system pretty quick when you've spending $30k+ on your vinyl front end.
I'm not saying spending more gets you a better system every time, but to an extent you wouldn't compare a Lambo to a Mustang.
Angsty
Well-Known Member
How about the Lambo brand slapped onto a Mustang?
displayname
Well-Known Member
Touché! I totally forgot about this. Hilarious!
Joe Mac
Well-Known Member
Back when Williams were winning world championships with Renault engines they didn’t have them co-design a traditional sports car a la the Mercedes McLaren or the McLaren F1. They said here’s a clio, knock yourself out. That car is epic, I’d take it over any 6 figure hyper sports car…
Equally that table is awful.
Jbraswell
Well-Known Member
displayname
Well-Known Member
Let's do some speculating. Does anyone think we see a new "flagship" offering from Technics in the near future? My thought is a 1300G style but built at or beyond the current 1200G. Obviously with the new power supply and maybe some other goodies.
They have a huge gap between the 1200G and the 1000RE. Might we see a $6-10k model in the future? I honestly don't know what they'd do, but I could see something like the 1200G motor, magnesium tonearm but with the ability to do more VTA like the 1300G, additional platter damping, external linear power supply, and the plinth design similar to the 1000 to accommodate additional arms or more easily accommodate tonearm changes. Also to just be more massive. Model number of 1100G or 1000G. Could even mix and match some features and have two new models in the line.
I probably wouldn't even be able to afford it, but if it came in around $6k I think they would have a really interesting position in the market.
They have a huge gap between the 1200G and the 1000RE. Might we see a $6-10k model in the future? I honestly don't know what they'd do, but I could see something like the 1200G motor, magnesium tonearm but with the ability to do more VTA like the 1300G, additional platter damping, external linear power supply, and the plinth design similar to the 1000 to accommodate additional arms or more easily accommodate tonearm changes. Also to just be more massive. Model number of 1100G or 1000G. Could even mix and match some features and have two new models in the line.
I probably wouldn't even be able to afford it, but if it came in around $6k I think they would have a really interesting position in the market.
Joe Mac
Well-Known Member
I think I read that they consider the SP10R and the various other models with bits added on to be the top of the hifi styled tables with a tick tock down the range between the dj and hifi styled one.
So
10R/1200G/1300G/1200GR2/1500/1200Mk7.
My guess is the next would be the 1200G2, it seems counterintuitive for a table the level down to have the same motor and a more advanced power supply and speed control than it.
displayname
Well-Known Member
I didn't count the SP-10R because it's not a ready to play solution direct from Technics. Yes, it's $10k... with no plinth and no arm.
So I think the line still has plenty of room for a 1100/1000G concept.
I do agree that we'll see a 1200G2 at some point. And I'd guess a $4500 price on that if it comes out in the near future. Unless they do a little more with it beyond just the power supply.
1500C - $1300
1200GR2 - $2200 (+70%)
1300G - $3300 (+50%)
1200G - $4300 (+30%)
HUGE GAP
1000RE - $20000 (+365%)
Let's do a 50% jump to make things a little cleaner, and I'll round up to cleaner numbers. I think they could easily fit 2-3 more models in the lineup, and still find ways to be competitive at those price points.
Wish model 1 - $6500
Imaginary 1100G - Delta Sigma drive 1200G + tonearm board and layout to more easily accommodate aftermarket tonearms, but plinth is nearly the same size
Wish model 2 - $9800
Imaginary 1000G - External power supply, larger more robust plinth, magnesium tonearm, new tonearm board with ability to add 2nd armboard, No extra weighting in the platter like 10-R.
Wish model 3 - $14700
100RE (Or some other numbering system, but a mini RE) - Includes everything the 1000RE has motor wise, but comes in a smaller plinth that is designed to reflect the original 1200G footprint. Only set up to accommodate tonearm changes that fit within the 10" body space, and only designed for one tone arm (gotta justify the move to 1000RE)
Seems fun right???
Joe Mac
Well-Known Member
Funnily enough whilst I like other technics tables and likely will eventually end up with one as my endgame, probably a 1300G or it’s replacement, the 10R is the only one I really covet. I love the modular idea and getting thst magnificient top of the tree motor and platter and then mating it with a really cool and beautiful third part plinth and a really fancy tonearm. I’m never going to be able to drip €12k on a turntable alone but it does make me ponder a refurbed 10 mk2 a lot! The 1000R and 1000re just leave me cold in comparison.