Political Discussion

Indymisanthrope said:
It's almost like Bernie's people spent the last 4 years nursing those grievances and making everyone distrust the system that he said couldn't be trusted. It's one of the fundamental weaknesses of his whole platform: an independent who runs as a Democrat to give control of the Democratic party to non-Democrats and then blows up when the Democrats don't want that.
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7) ?

The Lavar Ball syndrome is strong

 
Indymisanthrope said:
It's almost like Bernie's people spent the last 4 years nursing those grievances and making everyone distrust the system that he said couldn't be trusted. It's one of the fundamental weaknesses of his whole platform: an independent who runs as a Democrat to give control of the Democratic party to non-Democrats and then blows up when the Democrats don't want that.
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I also think Bernie's recent comments about the Democratic Establishment is not ready for them may have backfired. He's actively campaigning as a Democrat. How do you expect the Democrats to respond to that? I think it also added to his poor performance and might have been his "Deplorables" comment.


I think the VP pick will be huge. Biden, if he wins, will not likely run for a second term so whoever is chosen is likely going to be the next President.
 
Most of this is anecdotal, so do what you will with it.

We're the typical Northern Virginia family. There's plenty of privilege: middle class, educated, white. We're all Dems (except for that great aunt and her offspring down in Roanoke who all love Trump and well, yeah, that's made for some fun family gatherings). We all follow politics because we are in the middle of it all. All this to say: some of my family still thinks socialism = communism. They still think Biden is the best candidate (because the press tells them this). They still think Elizabeth is unelectable (because the press tells them this). Etc etc.

People at work: never even heard of Stacey Abrams, Amy Klobachar, etc., didn't know Pete was gay, Michelle Obama is definitely a man, etc. (I am honestly constantly surprised by the things people at work DON'T know - like today, a woman said, "There are types of apples other than red and green? I didn't know that.")

My point: I think we are a pretty informed group here. I also think we are the exception. Most people still get their news from reading headlines. Or listening to 5 second blurbs on the radio in between Lady Gaga's newest and the traffic report. I don't know how to combat that. But if that is what we're working with, then yes, Biden is who we're gonna get. And maybe the DNC knows that? Maybe they know that most of the country just looks for name recognition?

Sigh. I don't get to vote until April 28. I really really really wanted to vote for Elizabeth. I don't think I'll get the chance. I have maintained this since election night, 2016 - I will vote for whomever the Dems nominate. Trump is horrible and I fear for my personal safety if he is re-elected. To be clear: I fear a lot of things if he is re-elected but I'm really sick of being the subject of this unearthed hatred these last 4 years. As are most every minority group.

Please vote. Even if it isn't the candidate you wanted to win, please vote. There is too much at stake to opt out. And the in-fighting isn't helping. :(
 
Indymisanthrope said:
Slight change of topic: looking forward, what is going to happen with the party conventions? Assuming that coronavirus concerns are ongoing this summer, all of the remaining candidates in the race fit the high-risk profile on the basis of age alone.

But just in general, what's the wisdom around thousands of people from all around the country converging in one city and shaking each other's sweaty hands? Is this going to be a problem? And if it is, what do we do about it? We can cancel something like SXSW without damaging the country's ability to function. But how do you select your party's nominee without all of those people getting together face to face?

Edit: Despite my questions leading to sort of a worst-case scenario, I'm not trying to be alarmist about it, just asking whether it's a sensible thing that we need to consider.
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My mom mentioned SXSW being canceled. My response was: How? Sure, the official sponsors can pull the plug. But most of the shows are unofficial. I mean, I saw shows in parking lots, garages, back yards, a thrift shop, a book store, bars, fields, etc. I just don't see being able to cancel ALL of those unofficial shows.

Also, yeah, the convention is gonna be interesting. I have to wonder again - is there a better way of doing things?
 
Teeeee said:
We're the typical Northern Virginia family. There's plenty of privilege: middle class, educated, white. We're all Dems (except for that great aunt and her offspring down in Roanoke who all love Trump and well, yeah, that's made for some fun family gatherings). We all follow politics because we are in the middle of it all. All this to say: some of my family still thinks socialism = communism. They still think Biden is the best candidate (because the press tells them this). They still think Elizabeth is unelectable (because the press tells them this). Etc etc.
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When it comes to my family. My father, uncles, basically any male who is a baby boomer or older are Trump supporters. All the women and everyone of my generation are Bernie supporters. With the exception of the part of the family who moved to North Carolina 15 years ago and work in the banking industry. They are hard core Trump Supporters.

What really get's me is the how these people refer to Trump at family get togethers.

For example, if Trump's name comes up my uncle will say "that's my boy!" or "yeah buddy!" Any political discussion that comes up it's "Trump will take care of it"

It's like Trump's part of the "boys club". I have never heard this with any president before.

Also, not sure what to make of the "Trump will take care of it" comments. Because I feel like by taking care of it it will hurt their self interests.
 
RenegadeMonster said:
When it comes to my family. My father, uncles, basically any male who is a baby boomer or older are Trump supporters. All the women and everyone of my generation are Bernie supporters. With the exception of the part of the family who moved to North Carolina 15 years ago and work in the banking industry. They are hard core Trump Supporters.

What really get's me is the how these people refer to Trump at family get togethers.

For example, if Trump's name comes up my uncle will say "that's my boy!" or "yeah buddy!" Any political discussion that comes up it's "Trump will take care of it"

It's like Trump's part of the "boys club". I have never heard this with any president before.

Also, not sure what to make of the "Trump will take care of it" comments. Because I feel like by taking care of it it will hurt their self interests.
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Misogyny is ever present on both sides of the aisle and as far right and left as you want to go.

Trumps dog whistling has not only given permission to supremacists and racists of every ilk but every insecure male that finds security and validation in viewing themselves as the superior gender.

People always have voted for what they believe is in their self interest. I qualified it that way because supporting systems that actually harm you in the end isn't in people's self interest but "long-term" thinking is hard for most people, especially people that are worried about their immediate future or protecting their tailwind.
 
The stock market is finally surging today after more than a week of steep decline over coronavirus fears.

Todays surge is attributed to Joe Biden's results in the Super Tuesday election. As one financial expert says "Wall Street wants Trump, but if it's a Democrat who wins the election Joe Biden is not all that bad."


It really scares me when they refer to Joe Biden as "not all that bad". Really goes to show that his interest are with Wall Street and not America.
 
RenegadeMonster said:
The stock market is finally surging today after more than a week of steep decline over coronavirus fears.

Todays surge is attributed to Joe Biden's results in the Super Tuesday election. As one financial expert says "Wall Street wants Trump, but if it's a Democrat who wins the election Joe Biden is not all that bad."


It really scares me when they refer to Joe Biden as "not all that bad". Really goes to show that his interest are with Wall Street and not America.
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Tells you all you need to know about Biden too.

That analysis about the markets bouncing today is a load of bollocks though.
 
Indymisanthrope said:
It's almost like Bernie's people spent the last 4 years nursing those grievances and making everyone distrust the system that he said couldn't be trusted. It's one of the fundamental weaknesses of his whole platform: an independent who runs as a Democrat to give control of the Democratic party to non-Democrats and then blows up when the Democrats don't want that.
Click to expand...
oprahthereitis.gif
 
This early morning tangent from a Gen X, die-hard Pete supporter (who viewed him as a compromise between generations) is pure poetry. As deliciously cathartic as ketamine and a pile of puppy dogs.

"Boomer democrats have convinced themselves the only way to beat trump is to stand for as little as possible. That’s Joes entire platform, if you cut out the American flags and spin.

That’s what is going on. Don’t try and fix things much, dont rock the boat, don’t try and address issues with new ideas, just be as uninspired as possible. Be as routine and lazy and focused grouped as you can. You want a nice dinner? No no, too hard, here’s canned tuna emptied out on a salad. Hey, it’s better than the food poisoning you got last night.

trump isn’t an anomaly. He’s A symptom of an illness that neoliberalism helped create.

Healthcare? No no, Obamacare just needs a little tlc. Student debt? No no, it just needs better rates. Climate change? Yea let’s definitely have another commission or two to discuss what to do. Legalization? No weed is a gateway drug! Remember M*A*S*H? What a great tv show.

Y’all are cowards. Truly.

I can’t wait to NOT vote for Joe Biden on the 14th. Unsure if warren or Sanders gets my vote at this point. Probably Sanders because at this point I just want to use a flamethrower on everything.

And once that’s done congratulations you’ve stolen another election from your children who, last I checked the numbers, voted for Biden at a rate of 5%

You’re not listening. Again. Young voters need to vote more. True. You know what would help that? If the system they are voting in wasn’t trash. If they felt welcomed in our party and not viewed as crazy or Marxist stalinists because they think student debt needs to be forgiven. If basic asks like not having to set up a go fund me to not die wasn’t viewed by their parents as “too radical.”

You completely miss the point that even if Biden wins, even if Trump is kicked to the curb, we are still in dystopia. My generation is still going to be saddled with crippling debt, premiums that they can’t pay for, working jobs that lead nowhere, because you didn’t have the courage to stand for something. Or more specifically you didn’t have the courage to admit that maybe it’s time to let your children have their say. But at least the president will be nice and probably gives good Christmas gifts

Over it. I’m leaving the Democratic Party after this primary and registering as an independent.

So sure. Run Michelle Obama or Pete or Abrams as your VP. Gloss over the intractability of your analog beliefs. Or don’t I don’t care, I’m voting for Biden in November anyway. Because unlike your selfish generation, I actually comprehend sacrifice for the greater good.

Assholes."
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
And once that’s done congratulations you’ve stolen another election from your children who, last I checked the numbers, voted for Biden at a rate of 5%
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My issue is millennials outnumber boomers now as a voting bloc. As a millennial myself, I really wish we voted more. We are grown-ups (kinda) now we need to take the reins. We were dealt a shitty hand but we need to stop blaming other generations about it and actually do something about it. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem like we are are ready to do that (as a generation) yet.
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
This early morning tangent from a Gen X, die-hard Pete supporter (who viewed him as a compromise between generations) is pure poetry. As deliciously cathartic as ketamine and a pile of puppy dogs.

"Boomer democrats have convinced themselves the only way to beat trump is to stand for as little as possible. That’s Joes entire platform, if you cut out the American flags and spin.

That’s what is going on. Don’t try and fix things much, dont rock the boat, don’t try and address issues with new ideas, just be as uninspired as possible. Be as routine and lazy and focused grouped as you can. You want a nice dinner? No no, too hard, here’s canned tuna emptied out on a salad. Hey, it’s better than the food poisoning you got last night.

trump isn’t an anomaly. He’s A symptom of an illness that neoliberalism helped create.

Healthcare? No no, Obamacare just needs a little tlc. Student debt? No no, it just needs better rates. Climate change? Yea let’s definitely have another commission or two to discuss what to do. Legalization? No weed is a gateway drug! Remember M*A*S*H? What a great tv show.

Y’all are cowards. Truly.

I can’t wait to NOT vote for Joe Biden on the 14th. Unsure if warren or Sanders gets my vote at this point. Probably Sanders because at this point I just want to use a flamethrower on everything.

And once that’s done congratulations you’ve stolen another election from your children who, last I checked the numbers, voted for Biden at a rate of 5%

You’re not listening. Again. Young voters need to vote more. True. You know what would help that? If the system they are voting in wasn’t trash. If they felt welcomed in our party and not viewed as crazy or Marxist stalinists because they think student debt needs to be forgiven. If basic asks like not having to set up a go fund me to not die wasn’t viewed by their parents as “too radical.”

You completely miss the point that even if Biden wins, even if Trump is kicked to the curb, we are still in dystopia. My generation is still going to be saddled with crippling debt, premiums that they can’t pay for, working jobs that lead nowhere, because you didn’t have the courage to stand for something. Or more specifically you didn’t have the courage to admit that maybe it’s time to let your children have their say. But at least the president will be nice and probably gives good Christmas gifts

Over it. I’m leaving the Democratic Party after this primary and registering as an independent.

So sure. Run Michelle Obama or Pete or Abrams as your VP. Gloss over the intractability of your analog beliefs. Or don’t I don’t care, I’m voting for Biden in November anyway. Because unlike your selfish generation, I actually comprehend sacrifice for the greater good.

Assholes."
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So confusing based on some of the actual good points made by this person why they would be a diehard Pete supporter.
 
BjorgenFjorgen said:
So confusing based on some of the actual good points made by this person why they would be a diehard Pete supporter.
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But that might be part of the problem. I love Bernie, I wish everyone would vote for him but Mayor Pete, Corey Booker, Warren, Klobachar, etc. were good candidates I wish more of their supporters would now support Bernie none were perfect (neither is Bernie) the indignation is NOT a great attribute when trying to grow a coalition.
 
TenderLovingKiller® said:
But that might be part of the problem. I love Bernie, I wish everyone would vote for him but Mayor Pete, Corey Booker, Warren, Klobachar, etc. were good candidates I wish more of their supporters would now support Bernie none were perfect (neither is Bernie) the indignation is NOT a great attribute when trying to grow a coalition.
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I'm not really going to comment on that, but I meant that this person seems to have a lot of qualms with--forgive the terminology--the "establishment" and the circumstances that brought us here. Pete's campaign was decidedly not that.
 
DownIsTheNewUp said:
This early morning tangent from a Gen X, die-hard Pete supporter (who viewed him as a compromise between generations) is pure poetry. As deliciously cathartic as ketamine and a pile of puppy dogs.

"Boomer democrats have convinced themselves the only way to beat trump is to stand for as little as possible. That’s Joes entire platform, if you cut out the American flags and spin.

That’s what is going on. Don’t try and fix things much, dont rock the boat, don’t try and address issues with new ideas, just be as uninspired as possible. Be as routine and lazy and focused grouped as you can. You want a nice dinner? No no, too hard, here’s canned tuna emptied out on a salad. Hey, it’s better than the food poisoning you got last night.

trump isn’t an anomaly. He’s A symptom of an illness that neoliberalism helped create.

Healthcare? No no, Obamacare just needs a little tlc. Student debt? No no, it just needs better rates. Climate change? Yea let’s definitely have another commission or two to discuss what to do. Legalization? No weed is a gateway drug! Remember M*A*S*H? What a great tv show.

Y’all are cowards. Truly.

I can’t wait to NOT vote for Joe Biden on the 14th. Unsure if warren or Sanders gets my vote at this point. Probably Sanders because at this point I just want to use a flamethrower on everything.

And once that’s done congratulations you’ve stolen another election from your children who, last I checked the numbers, voted for Biden at a rate of 5%

You’re not listening. Again. Young voters need to vote more. True. You know what would help that? If the system they are voting in wasn’t trash. If they felt welcomed in our party and not viewed as crazy or Marxist stalinists because they think student debt needs to be forgiven. If basic asks like not having to set up a go fund me to not die wasn’t viewed by their parents as “too radical.”

You completely miss the point that even if Biden wins, even if Trump is kicked to the curb, we are still in dystopia. My generation is still going to be saddled with crippling debt, premiums that they can’t pay for, working jobs that lead nowhere, because you didn’t have the courage to stand for something. Or more specifically you didn’t have the courage to admit that maybe it’s time to let your children have their say. But at least the president will be nice and probably gives good Christmas gifts

Over it. I’m leaving the Democratic Party after this primary and registering as an independent.

So sure. Run Michelle Obama or Pete or Abrams as your VP. Gloss over the intractability of your analog beliefs. Or don’t I don’t care, I’m voting for Biden in November anyway. Because unlike your selfish generation, I actually comprehend sacrifice for the greater good.

Assholes."
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Maybe at the ripe old age of 39 I'm developing Boomerish tendencies but I summarise this as; 'I am upset that things of concern to me are not represented in their entirety in the political options available. Therefore I will be taking steps to further diminish my influence in raising these areas of concern."
 
BjorgenFjorgen said:
So confusing based on some of the actual good points made by this person why they would be a diehard Pete supporter.
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Because as a 40 year old, he was close enough to the edges of two generations to view Pete as a compromise.

His anger stems from the fact that the DNC put all of its weight behind Biden in the way that they did. Because for a lot of us, it was as much about never-Biden / Bloomberg as it was anything else.

Ed Selley said:
Maybe at the ripe old age of 39 I'm developing Boomerish tendencies but I summarise this as; 'I am upset that things of concern to me are not represented in their entirety in the political options available. Therefore I will be taking steps to further diminish my influence in raising these areas of concern."
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Open primaries are a thing in a lot of states.

TenderLovingKiller® said:
My issue is millennials outnumber boomers now as a voting bloc. As a millennial myself, I really wish we voted more. We are grown-ups (kinda) now we need to take the reins. We were dealt a shitty hand but we need to stop blaming other generations about it and actually do something about it. Unfortunately, it doesn’t seem like we are are ready to do that (as a generation) yet.
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Absolutely. But it isn’t quite as clear cut as you’re making it. The +45 crowd still outnumbers the 18-45 crowd by a solid margin. It’s also worth pointing out that, while apathy played a roll, so did voter suppression.

Check out the news stories about the young, Latino sides of LA yesterday and how long the lines were due to broken machines. I had friends who waited 3 hours to vote. In Texas people were waiting 7(!) hours to vote after last minute closures of a plethora of voting stations. Meanwhile, a bunch of states keep making it harder and harder for college kids to vote...
 
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