Political Discussion

ranbalam said:
I don't have anything to add, except I'm now preparing for a Trump presidency and hoping it's not as bad as it feels like it's going to be.

Also, this country is kind of ridiculous.
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I need to drink more coffee, I read that as "preparing for a Trump pregnancy" and was confused and had so many questions.
 
Indymisanthrope said:
I think you could make a strong argument that in fact he IS the best candidate, and that's the problem.
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If that's true, and I don't personally think it is but I know many do, then the Dems are as dumb as I've always thought for not cultivating anyone in the public eye to replace the geriatric.

And 😩
 
MyWifeHatesTrain said:
The conservatives want a return to 1950s America because it looks so idyllic in movies but to the best of my knowledge didn’t actually exist.

Nostalgia is a hell of a drug. Just spend some time around here.
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I said it on here before but the book I read, A Fever in the Heartland, really reinforces how much right now feels like the 1920s. Everything Trump claims is bad can be blamed by him on immigrants. This was the same playbook used back then. Demonize the immigrant, appeal to how things were "better before they arrived", they're taking your jobs away, nostalgia, nostalgia, nostalgia. Hatred of the other always plays well even when you have no actual chance to meet this other that you fear so much. Same with trans people. How many trans people do these scared MAGAs ever actually run into? Yet there's this massive fear over a small minority because they are different.

I really wonder at what point people will wake up to realize just how badly they are being played by the media, social media companies, and politicians who only care about access to power?
 
mdmost said:
I said it on here before but the book I read, A Fever in the Heartland, really reinforces how much right now feels like the 1920s. Everything Trump claims is bad can be blamed by him on immigrants. This was the same playbook used back then. Demonize the immigrant, appeal to how things were "better before they arrived", they're taking your jobs away, nostalgia, nostalgia, nostalgia. Hatred of the other always plays well even when you have no actual chance to meet this other that you fear so much. Same with trans people. How many trans people do these scared MAGAs ever actually run into? Yet there's this massive fear over a small minority because they are different.

I really wonder at what point people will wake up to realize just how badly they are being played by the media, social media companies, and politicians who only care about access to power?
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Yep. This one hundred percent.
 
Indymisanthrope said:
I think you could make a strong argument that in fact he IS the best candidate, and that's the problem.
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Here's the problem, the Democratic bench is very weak. Kamala should be the person to step in and win this. But she probably should've never been the VP choice. But I get it, Joe wanted to pick a black female to break two glass ceilings. The problem is she wasn't a great option to begin with and no one thought it was a good idea to push for a better person to possibly take over for the oldest president ever. Now, we're in a position where an even more unpopular VP isn't going to save us from another Trump presidency. If anything, she will push more moderate people to Trump because whether they want to admit it or not, they will put her race and gender as negatives because she is not like them.

The Democratic machine could push someone up in place of Biden but who exactly wins this? Newsome could destroy Trump in every debate. He's still the governor of a state people have been told for 50+ years is the epitome of failed liberal policies. The media would pepper us with images of San Francisco, Oakland, and LA homeless to show how Newsome can't even help people in his own state. Pete? He could also destroy Trump in a debate just as he destroys most Republicans when he's called before Congress or goes on Fox News. Does he move the needle with middle America, people in Michigan, Arizona, Georgia, Virginia, and the only states that now matter due to the electoral college?

I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
 
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mdmost said:
I said it on here before but the book I read, A Fever in the Heartland, really reinforces how much right now feels like the 1920s. Everything Trump claims is bad can be blamed by him on immigrants. This was the same playbook used back then. Demonize the immigrant, appeal to how things were "better before they arrived", they're taking your jobs away, nostalgia, nostalgia, nostalgia. Hatred of the other always plays well even when you have no actual chance to meet this other that you fear so much. Same with trans people. How many trans people do these scared MAGAs ever actually run into? Yet there's this massive fear over a small minority because they are different.

I really wonder at what point people will wake up to realize just how badly they are being played by the media, social media companies, and politicians who only care about access to power?
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Yeah, great points.

The people I know that are Republicans, even the ones that claim to not like Trump, pretty much exhibit behavior that shows they dislike that other people's privilege is catching up, which makes their privilege feel/seem diminished. They don't quite say it out loud, but it's fairly apparent.
 
We have been running people from the Obama administration since 2008 and have not properly built up anyone younger to take over the party. I get it, Obama was great and we want to replicate that success but we have needed a new party leader since Clinton lost in 2016! The past 4 years were the perfect time to do that and they didn’t. Even if Biden won in November I don’t think we have any candidates truly ready to run in 2028, so how are we supposed to find some new for 2024. I think Whitmer is are best candidate but she needs more time to build her national image
 
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mdmost said:
Here's the problem, the Democratic bench is very weak. Kamala should be the person to step in and win this. But she probably should've never been the VP choice. But I get it, Joe wanted to pick a black female to break two glass ceilings. Now, we're in a position where an even more unpopular VP isn't going to save us from another Trump presidency. The Democratic machine could push someone up in place of Biden but who exactly wins this? Newsome could destroy Trump in every debate. He's still the governor of a state people have been told for 50+ years is the epitome of failed liberal policies. The media would pepper us with images of San Francisco, Oakland, and LA homeless to show how Newsome can't even help people in his own state. Pete? He could also destroy Trump in a debate just as he destroys most Republicans when he's called before Congress or goes on Fox News. Does he move the needle with middle America, people in Michigan, Arizona, Georgia, Virginia, and the only states that no matter due to the electoral college?

I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
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It is not as weak as you think it is. JB Pritzker would be a great candidate, he doesn't have the name recognition right now but he is a really sharp personable guy. I think Newsom is a good candidate as well. I mean I don't see a Barack Obama in the party at the moment but some candidates that are better Joe and Kamala.
 
mdmost said:
Here's the problem, the Democratic bench is very weak. Kamala should be the person to step in and win this. But she probably should've never been the VP choice. But I get it, Joe wanted to pick a black female to break two glass ceilings. The problem is she wasn't a great option to begin with and no one thought it was a good idea to push for a better person to possibly take over for the oldest president ever. Now, we're in a position where an even more unpopular VP isn't going to save us from another Trump presidency. If anything, she will push more moderate people to Trump because whether they want to admit it or not, they will put her race and gender as negatives because she is not like them.

The Democratic machine could push someone up in place of Biden but who exactly wins this? Newsome could destroy Trump in every debate. He's still the governor of a state people have been told for 50+ years is the epitome of failed liberal policies. The media would pepper us with images of San Francisco, Oakland, and LA homeless to show how Newsome can't even help people in his own state. Pete? He could also destroy Trump in a debate just as he destroys most Republicans when he's called before Congress or goes on Fox News. Does he move the needle with middle America, people in Michigan, Arizona, Georgia, Virginia, and the only states that no matter due to the electoral college?

I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
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I see your points and you make a strong case. Fine, I’ll do it. 🫡
 
mdmost said:
Here's the problem, the Democratic bench is very weak. Kamala should be the person to step in and win this. But she probably should've never been the VP choice. But I get it, Joe wanted to pick a black female to break two glass ceilings. The problem is she wasn't a great option to begin with and no one thought it was a good idea to push for a better person to possibly take over for the oldest president ever. Now, we're in a position where an even more unpopular VP isn't going to save us from another Trump presidency. If anything, she will push more moderate people to Trump because whether they want to admit it or not, they will put her race and gender as negatives because she is not like them.

The Democratic machine could push someone up in place of Biden but who exactly wins this? Newsome could destroy Trump in every debate. He's still the governor of a state people have been told for 50+ years is the epitome of failed liberal policies. The media would pepper us with images of San Francisco, Oakland, and LA homeless to show how Newsome can't even help people in his own state. Pete? He could also destroy Trump in a debate just as he destroys most Republicans when he's called before Congress or goes on Fox News. Does he move the needle with middle America, people in Michigan, Arizona, Georgia, Virginia, and the only states that no matter due to the electoral college?

I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
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I think the only one that could pull in progressives to moderates is Whitmer. I like Buttigieg even less than Biden and Harris, and I do not like either of them. He's a carbon copy of Mckinsey corporate branding and frankly is only out for himself. Newsome is slightly better because like Hillary he knows how to pander to both sides and play the politics of the Democratic machine, but that's also his biggest weakness because that model doesn't work well in this current reality anymore. But outside of those three, I don't know if anyone who has a national profile big enough to step in. Michelle Obama is still the obvious name, but she doesn't want to do it and I'm very much over political families. Still if she were to do it then I think she'd crush Trump. She'd be hated and viciously opposed, but she also get a lot more traction than the alternatives. Funnily I don't see her being Black or a Woman as a handicap like it's talked about being for Harris, and I think that has a lot more to do with how unlikable Harris is and how bad many viewed her policies. I mean her advisors had to be fucking with her given how outlandishly dumb some of the policies she suggested in the last primary were. I just couldn't believe that they thought those would help her win. It seemed almost like intentional sabotage.
 
mdmost said:
I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
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The left was hoping Biden could carry them for 4 more years instead of growing future leaders.

The Governor or PA, Josh Shapiro, Michigan, Whitmere, and Maryland, Wes Moore would have all been excellent candidates too. I think Newsom would be tougher than many on the right would admit.

Had any decided to push Biden early instead of failing In line, maybe we could have had a legitimate primary and seen Biden debate in a primary last year, if he preformed like this who knows what would have happened.
 
mdmost said:
Here's the problem, the Democratic bench is very weak. Kamala should be the person to step in and win this. But she probably should've never been the VP choice. But I get it, Joe wanted to pick a black female to break two glass ceilings. The problem is she wasn't a great option to begin with and no one thought it was a good idea to push for a better person to possibly take over for the oldest president ever. Now, we're in a position where an even more unpopular VP isn't going to save us from another Trump presidency. If anything, she will push more moderate people to Trump because whether they want to admit it or not, they will put her race and gender as negatives because she is not like them.

The Democratic machine could push someone up in place of Biden but who exactly wins this? Newsome could destroy Trump in every debate. He's still the governor of a state people have been told for 50+ years is the epitome of failed liberal policies. The media would pepper us with images of San Francisco, Oakland, and LA homeless to show how Newsome can't even help people in his own state. Pete? He could also destroy Trump in a debate just as he destroys most Republicans when he's called before Congress or goes on Fox News. Does he move the needle with middle America, people in Michigan, Arizona, Georgia, Virginia, and the only states that now matter due to the electoral college?

I almost feel this is the course correction the Democrats need. I just have no faith our country and institutions can survive another 4 years of Trump looking to settle scores and giving carte blanche to the worst of humanity like Stephen Miller. To say I'm pessimistic would be an understatement.
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Worse, I don’t think we only get four years. He and his republicans cronies will either push for a third term or he will dismantle the democracy.
 
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